Participants: Shelley Quinn (Host), Steve Wohlberg
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000419
00:01 Today books, movies and TV programs are invading society
00:08 promoting vampirism, romanticizing evil.
00:12 Is this just harmless fiction or is this a demonically
00:16 inspired plan that is going to lead our youth into evil?
00:20 Stay tuned for Issues and Answers and we will give you
00:24 some surprising answers.
00:29 Music being played.
00:51 Hello, I'm Shelley Quinn and we're so glad that you could
00:54 join us today because this is a topic that we need some
00:59 information on. You know, the Bible says in Psalm 34:14:
01:04 Depart from evil and do good, seek peace and pursue it.
01:09 But this vampire craze that has captured the hearts of teens
01:15 around the world is something that we as Christians need to be
01:21 aware of and that we need to know how to address.
01:24 Our very special guest today is Pastor Steve Wohlberg and he
01:29 is the speaker/director for White Horse Medias.
01:32 Steve, you've written, what, 24 or 25 books now haven't you?
01:36 Something like that. Yes and the Lord has blessed.
01:38 We're so glad that you're back on 3ABN.
01:41 Thank you, Shelley. It's great to be with you and to be here.
01:44 Well you know you've got a small book out called The Darkness of
01:48 Twilight. This is just one of those little pocket books and
01:51 you've addressed this issue. It seems to me Steve... I know that
01:55 you were one of the first in our church to address the Harry
01:59 Potter issue. Seems like God has called you to a ministry of
02:03 identifying things that are happening out in our world
02:09 and this is a craze, this vampirism and this Twilight
02:15 series, is a craze that is even becoming more popular than the
02:21 Harry Potter series. What is spawning, if you will, the
02:25 vampire craze. Right, you're right. It is more
02:27 popular than Harry Potter right now. Potter is kind of on the
02:31 downslide and Twilight is on the rise. I think as I look at the
02:34 phenomenon I think that the reason why Twilight... there are
02:38 many reasons. It's a multifaceted subject but a
02:41 couple of main reasons why Twilight has become so popular
02:44 is because... Now let's explain first what
02:46 is, because some people may not even know.
02:49 Sure, sure. The Twilight series is a four-part series of books,
02:53 of novels, fictitious novels, somewhat comparable to the
02:57 Harry Potter novels, but instead of the hero being a wizard like
03:02 Harry Potter, in Twilight the hero is a vampire and the hero
03:07 falls in love with an average normal teenage girl, a regular
03:11 human and it's basically what they are calling a series of
03:15 vampire romances between this boy, who is a vampire, and
03:19 this girl, who is normal, and the drama that surrounds their
03:23 relationship. What's happened is that the books have become so
03:26 popular. They were authored by Stepnenie Meyer, who is a
03:30 Mormon woman from the Phoenix area. These books have become
03:34 so popular that a production company decided to make the
03:37 first book into a movie to see if it would fly and the results
03:41 were about 70 million dollars that rolled in opening weekend
03:45 when the first Twilight movie hit the theater. Then they
03:49 decided well this is so great we've got to make the last three
03:53 into movies. So the second movie came out and it was 240 million
03:58 dollars that rolled in during opening weekend, which
04:01 catapulted Twilight to number three as far as all-time box
04:05 office openers. So there are more movies to come. They are
04:09 making one based on every novel and it has really become the
04:12 rage of teenagers, not just in North America, but around the
04:17 world. So It's a big issue and the reason why I believe God
04:21 has led me to address topics like Harry Potter and Twilight
04:25 is because one reason is that I'm a father, I'm a husband
04:28 and a father. I've got two little kids and I'm concerned
04:31 about young people and for some reason the Lord has just led me
04:35 to focus on this because there are very real dangers that are
04:39 underneath this series that parents and young people need to
04:44 be aware of and need to avoid.
04:46 When we think about the dangers and the issues, let's just go
04:49 back for just a second to the Harry Potter series, we have
04:53 seen across the nation, and I'm not sure about the statistics
04:57 around the world but I'm very familiar across the nation, we
05:01 have seen a very high rise in Wicca, the religion of Wicca.
05:07 I know that in our own area in a town not too far from us there
05:12 is a university and there are more youth who are following
05:18 the Wiccan religion that there are who are Christians.
05:23 so this is something that sometimes... you know I can
05:28 remember watching many programs on regular networks, news
05:32 programs where they would talk about the Harry Potter craze
05:36 and they would say well I don't know why anyone could be upset,
05:41 it's only fiction. But fiction has its effect and especially on
05:46 young impressionable minds. What kind of effect... you know there
05:51 may be someone that's watching us and saying, Big deal, these
05:55 are fiction novels, fiction movies... what kind of effect
05:59 is this Twilight series, all of this... and it's not just the
06:04 Twilight series what are some of the TV programs?
06:05 There's the Vampire Diaries, there's True Blood, there's a
06:09 whole series of vampire-related movies and television shows.
06:12 And, as you mentioned, if you go back to the Harry Potter days
06:15 when Potter first took off, it wasn't just Harry Potter that
06:18 helped to fuel the witchcraft trend, but it was definitely
06:22 a big part of it. As you've mentioned, witchcraft has
06:26 become increasingly popular among young people and now
06:29 instead of witchcraft in Harry Potter, it's vampirism in
06:33 Twilight and I'm prepared to offer solid evidence that
06:37 vampirism itself is on the rise among young people and what we
06:41 are seeing, Shelley, is a trend toward the occult whether it's
06:45 witchcraft, whether it's vampirism, it's a trend toward
06:48 the occult and the way these movies and books are packaged
06:52 it seems like it's just fun and fantasy and fiction and there's
06:54 just nothing to worry about, but the reality is there are forces
06:58 working behind the scenes that are luring kids into the occult
07:01 and they're getting involved in record numbers and the public
07:05 generally doesn't see what's happening behind the scenes and
07:08 the damage that's being done as young people open their hearts
07:12 up to being invaded by dark forces, by Satan and his angels,
07:16 and what's happening with the occult. It's very real, it's
07:19 very powerful and it's dangerous.
07:20 Why would you think the Lord would even be against vampirism?
07:26 Well, in the Bible the ingesting of blood is strongly forbidden.
07:32 In the book of Genesis, after the flood, God told Noah and his
07:36 family no blood. If you go to the book of Leviticus, it was
07:40 very clear when God Israel out of Egypt and he gave them
07:44 certain restrictions that the ingesting of blood was to be
07:47 absolutely forbidden. Because the life is in the blood
07:51 he said. That's right. Leviticus 19:26
07:53 talks about that. Then in verse 28 right after that it talks
07:58 about staying away from occultism and God knows that
08:02 if you go back to pagan societies the ingesting of blood
08:07 the drinking of blood, is often connected to occult rituals;
08:12 they go together. When you look at the Twilight series there is
08:16 also blood drinking, there's vampirism and we'll talk more
08:19 about the kind of blood drinking that's involved in it, but there
08:23 is also a lot of occultism there as well, even though it's very
08:27 sanitized in many ways, but it's still there and it's still very
08:31 dangerous. Twilight itself, I'm totally convinced, is a very
08:34 pleasant gateway to the occult. I also want to make something
08:38 plain right here, Shelley, that I'm sure that there are probably
08:42 people that are watching this program that are Twilight fans.
08:45 There are a lot of them out there. There are all kinds of
08:48 teenagers that love Twilight; they've seen the movies and they
08:51 love the characters. They're just absorbed in this. I want to
08:55 make it very clear that I am not on a crusade to take a stake
08:59 and pound it into the hearts of Twilight lovers. You know, I
09:03 recognize what's going on and I'm here to sound a sensible
09:06 warning and to try to open people's eyes to the dangers
09:09 that are lurking behind the scenes to this whole craze.
09:12 That's why I wrote my book, that's why our ministry is
09:15 addressing the subject head on.
09:16 In fact, you have a new book coming out on this and I believe
09:20 that... What is that title?
09:23 Well, it's called the Trouble With Twilight. This little book
09:25 published by Remnant is a small book, it's a pocket book, it's
09:28 The Darkness of Twilight, but there's a bigger book in the
09:31 that will be published shortly that will be in Christian book
09:35 across the country and it just expands upon the information
09:39 that's in that little book and it really hits the issue head-on
09:42 It was even eye opening to some people who worked in the
09:47 publishing house because there are even Christians who have
09:51 been caught up in this Twilight phase.
09:54 There are a lot of them, in fact yes, it's sort of, I don't how
09:58 to say it, inside information, but there are people even
10:02 within the publishing house of the larger book... you know
10:04 they've loved the Twilight series and so when they looked
10:07 at my manuscript, they critiqued it very carefully and they gave
10:11 me some very practical suggestions on how to improve it
10:14 because they're looking at it from a very sympathetic point of
10:17 view because they like Twilight and there are lots of people
10:19 that do. Well, and this is the point is
10:21 that when Satan presents sin he never puts it out looking like
10:27 it really is. He gift wraps it, if you will.
10:30 That's exactly right. He sugar coats it.
10:32 And he puts it in this foil paper and he puts a shiny bow on
10:36 it and he hands it off to us and it's so entertaining, but it's
10:40 nothing more than gift wrapped garbage. What kind of effect
10:44 is this fiction? I mean, why should parents or grandparents
10:48 who may be watching this program why should they be concerned
10:52 about their teen if they are, what do they call them,
10:57 Twihards, Twifans? And you know it's a franchise
11:00 right now. I mean, there are Twilight conferences, there are
11:04 movies, there are the books, there are countless websites,
11:07 the list goes on and on. There are T-shirts, buttons,
11:10 lunch pails, posters, I mean, it's just a huge rage among
11:14 teenage. A lot of parents have never heard of it but if they've
11:17 got kids just ask the young people, have you heard about
11:20 Twilight and they all know about it.
11:22 And it doesn't matter whether they're Christian or non
11:25 Christian, it's so has pervaded their atmosphere they can't
11:30 help but know. That's right. I've done all
11:31 kinds of radio interviews, you know that I do radio interviews
11:33 radio interviews. When the last Twilight movie came out, we sent
11:35 out a press release and I was booked on over a dozen shows
11:39 discussing this. A couple of them were national shows and
11:42 the phone lines opened up, people called in and it was just
11:44 quite a buzz of different kinds of responses to our ministry and
11:50 the book that we've dealt with, but the majority of those, at
11:55 least on the Christian shows that I've been on, they call in
11:58 and they're very positive. On some of the news and talk
12:00 secular shows they just don't quite get it, but on the
12:03 conservative Christian shows the hosts and the callers know
12:07 that there is a real danger in the occult world and we're
12:11 trying to help kids to not get involved in that.
12:13 How do we know that fiction is really influencing the behavior,
12:19 other than entertainment, how do we know that fiction is
12:22 influencing the behavior of our children?
12:24 Sure, that's a great question. A lot of parents and young
12:28 people too will say, Hey, this is just fiction, it's just a
12:31 story, what are you worried about? Well I have an article
12:35 here that came out from the Canadian Press and the title is
12:39 Twilight Franchise Takes Bite Out of Bronzer As Youth Get
12:43 Ghostly. Here's a picture of the lead actress in the Twilight
12:47 series. What happens in the movies is that the boy, Edward
12:51 Cullen, that's his fictitious name, and the girl, Isabella
12:56 Swan, they wear very pale makeup. They're in the Forks,
13:01 Washington area where there's a lot of rain and it's cloudy and
13:04 their makeup preferences, especially the Cullen family,
13:08 who are the family of these vampires, they definitely move
13:11 in the direction of pale white faces. So this article says that
13:16 because of Twilight you've got teenagers all across Canada who
13:20 have changed their makeup preferences and that article
13:24 says that they have adjusted or adapted to what they're calling
13:28 vampire influenced makeup and so the bronzed look is out and
13:33 now they want more of the pale look because these kids who have
13:37 been watching the Twilight movies want to look more like
13:40 Edward and Bella. So when people say, Hey, it's just fiction, it
13:44 doesn't really affect their lives, this is just one simple
13:49 example about how fiction does influence people's lives. Even
13:53 though it's just a story, you've got all these teenagers that are
13:57 changing the way they put makeup on because of Twilight. I'm not
14:01 really that concerned about makeup, no, I'm just using this
14:05 as an illustration of the fact that people's lives are being
14:08 influenced and I can guarantee you there are all kinds of web
14:11 sites out there and chat rooms where people are discussing
14:15 vampirism as well and that's one of my concerns for sure.
14:19 There is a Bible principle and it's really well illustrated in
14:22 2 Corinthians 3:18 that we become what we behold and
14:27 let me ask you this because I have heard reports that there
14:32 are real vampires. To me I always thought a vampire was
14:37 just a fictitious character, but I've heard reports that there
14:43 are real vampires and vampirism is on the rise so explain what
14:47 a vampire is because there may be someone like me that was out
14:52 there who at one point in time thought this was just something
14:57 from a fiction story we saw when we were young.
14:58 It used to be that way predominantly although now it
15:02 has changed and just as Wicca is a growing religion so real
15:06 vampirism is on the rise. When the first Twilight movie came
15:10 out Shawn Hannity on Fox news ran a major story called Night
15:13 Neighbors about the growth of real vampirism. ABC news ran a
15:17 story. 20/20 has recently done a story and the title was
15:21 If You Love Twilight, Meet Real Vampires. The Washington Post
15:24 did a story and so there are all kinds of media reports that are
15:28 coming out that are looking at the growth of real vampires.
15:31 I think one of the reasons why this is happening is because in
15:35 Twilight the typical or the stereotypical creatures of the
15:39 night, which is what the vampires used to be like,
15:42 is very different in Twilight. Edward Cullen is the main
15:46 fictitious hero-boy character who falls in love with this
15:50 teenage girl. He's a 108-year- old vampire, he's handsome,
15:54 he drives a flashy car, he lives in a high vaulted ceiling house
15:58 contemporary home, he can handle some sunlight, he's very cool,
16:02 he's handsome, he's got super natural powers and in the
16:05 Twilight saga he's a good vampire. He's what they call a
16:08 vegetarian vampire, which means he has overcome his natural
16:12 inclination to drink human blood and he's resisted that and he
16:16 just subsists on animal blood. He protects Bella, he uses
16:20 his powers to guard her against evil vampires and he's the good
16:25 guy and when you portray the good guy as a vampire still
16:29 what happens is the whole idea of being a cool vampire, it just
16:33 gets into people and they want to know more about it and the
16:37 reality is that vampirism is on the rise. Here's another article
16:41 that I have that came out of Australia and it came out from
16:45 a publication called the Sunday Mail. It came out four days
16:49 before the last Twilight movie hit. I'll just read you a few of
16:53 these quotations here. The title is called Fangs for Tickets:
16:57 Vampire Film Frenzy and it says it's bigger than Star Wars, Lord
17:01 of the Rings and Harry Potter. It's the largest film release in
17:04 Queensland history, it's only four days away. It talks about
17:07 how big Twilight is and the incredible hysteria and then
17:10 it says here at the end of the article: Twilight hysteria is
17:14 also being blamed for a plethora of clans appearing in Australia.
17:18 Groups of self-professed blood thirsty vampires conduct rituals
17:22 once a month across Queensland, New South Wales and Victoria.
17:25 One member, 40-year-old Mark, who did not want his surname
17:28 published claims to consume blood on a regular basis. He
17:31 says, We're real, we're alive, we live, we work in cities, we
17:35 hold jobs, we're your next door neighbor, we have families, but
17:38 we just have a different understanding, he said.
17:40 And that's the way this article finishes and I can document
17:44 all kinds of other reports that there is a strain of vampirism
17:49 that is becoming popular in our world. It's just like Wicca.
17:54 Wicca says we only practice white magic, we're the good
17:58 guys, we're not doing dark magic just white magic. We're trying
18:02 help people and the main form of vampirism today, many times they
18:06 refer to it as ethical vampirism and what happens is
18:09 it may sound bizarre to a lot of us, but somebody wants to drink
18:14 blood and so they find a donor, they have a consensual
18:18 relationship where the donor says it's okay. They sign a
18:22 document. They test the donor's blood to make sure that she
18:26 doesn't have AIDS or some disease, he or she, and then
18:29 they sanitize their instruments and then they poke the skin
18:33 and take a little bit of blood, maybe an ounce a week and the
18:38 vampire will drink this blood for the purpose of trying to
18:42 enhance his or her well-being to feed some kind of a
18:45 deficiency in their diet, to make themselves healthier
18:49 and happier and more energized. So you've got ethical vampirism
18:55 that's growing and these articles say... and there's
18:57 research out there that's available to the media where
19:00 many of these people are doctors and lawyers and professionals
19:03 and they're doing this on a regular basis and they don't see
19:06 anything wrong with it and they have come out as they say,
19:10 witches came out of the closet, now vampirism is coming out of
19:14 the coffin and they are trying to sanitize it and make it
19:18 something that's okay.
19:19 Steve, it occurs to me that what we have going on here is
19:24 I think part of the reason that teens were so taken by Harry
19:28 Potter, and youth, they're looking for a power in their
19:34 lives and the people with the vampirism who are drinking blood
19:39 they're looking for a power, something to empower them, and
19:43 the reason we should be as Christians concerned other than
19:47 it is... they call it ethical, it sounds unethical to me
19:50 other than the fact that it is against the scriptures that say
19:57 not to partake of blood, the reason we should be alarmed
20:01 and recognize that this is Satan's working in our society
20:05 is it seems that in both cases the authors of these books have
20:11 been relatively obscure women who had never published anything
20:15 before and there's almost like a demonic power. They both got
20:18 them through dreams, I know you're going to back and we'll
20:21 talk about this, but they both got them through dreams and they
20:27 just absolutely were catapulted and the trajectory into the
20:31 public and there's something supernatural about what happened
20:37 there, but instead of looking for power from God, the Spirit,
20:44 the Holy Spirit in his power, it's like the devil has them
20:49 turning toward these end times looking to someplace else for
20:54 power. It looks so much more exciting than what we're talking
20:59 about. That's right. Well, most people
21:02 out there generally they don't know what the Bible says. We
21:06 live in a society where atheism, at least among the scientific
21:09 community, is in the majority. Evolution is the dominant
21:13 belief system in the public schools and the biology text
21:16 books and in the national parks. So kids are growing up in this
21:20 environment not knowing. They don't really know God and they
21:23 are searching for something and they're searching for
21:25 supernatural power, they're searching for help in their
21:28 lives and so they read the Twilight novels, they watch the
21:31 movie, they see Edward Cullen, this super cool, attractive,
21:35 handsome vampire boy who can climb trees faster than Spider
21:38 Man, who's got all these super natural powers, who can read
21:41 minds and they look at that and they think, Hey, you know,
21:45 that is really cool, and he's a good guy. Shelley, it is very
21:48 easy to go from a book to a movie to a website and then
21:52 to checking out real vampirism. It's happening all the time.
21:55 Kids are being lured into this thinking, Hey, I'm going to
21:57 check this out. You know, that looks cool, that looks fun, I
22:00 want spiritual power and what they don't know is that they're
22:03 stepping into the occult world and Satan is right there luring
22:06 them on and his goal is to invade their hearts, invade
22:09 their lives, lead them away from Jesus Christ entirely and to
22:13 possess their souls and I'm totally convinced without
22:17 question that Twilight is part of a Satanic strategy that is
22:21 going on behind the scenes of an ancient being whose name
22:25 used to be Lucifer, now it's Satan, and who is working to
22:28 lure kids into the occult and Twilight is very much a part of
22:32 his plan. Our little book that I have written and our ministry
22:36 is designed to sound the warning and that it's to direct young
22:40 people, young and old, away from this kind of craze and to direct
22:45 them to someone else and someone else's blood. We can
22:48 talk about this later on in another program about the blood
22:51 battle, but I think we're in a blood battle and Satan is
22:54 directing people to the blood of vampirism when God is trying
22:57 to direct people to the blood of Jesus Christ his son, because
23:00 that's the only blood that can cleanse us from sin, that can
23:04 result in a clean conscience and forgiveness and it's only His
23:08 power that can come into our hearts and give us real peace
23:11 and joy and love. Behind the scenes we're in a battle
23:14 between God and the devil and Twilight is part of that battle.
23:19 Amen. I'm so thankful that God has raised you up. You know,
23:23 we always need someone who's going to respond because I
23:29 realize that... I was on vacation not too long ago for a
23:35 few days off and was in an area where my eyes were opened.
23:41 Because it was like I had stepped out of my protected
23:44 bubble into an area that was very modern and just totally a
23:50 different culture and I realized Lord don't let me get so
23:55 spiritual minded that I am of no earthly good because
23:59 it's so easy for us Christians to spend our time in church, we
24:04 spend our time associating with one another. It's easy for us to
24:09 forget that there is a real world out there that really
24:12 needs our help. That's right. You know, some
24:15 people think well what in the world are you doing talking
24:18 about vampires. But the reality is that a lot of kids are
24:21 getting into this and we need to address it and to try to open
24:24 their eyes and sound a sensible warning. Like I said, that's why
24:28 we have the book, that's why we have our website that deals
24:31 with this, that's why I've been on all these radio and
24:33 television shows, that's why we are here and we're trying to
24:36 sound a sensible warning to open people's eyes. I'll just
24:39 tell you one quick story. I got a phone call from the school
24:43 board chairman of a Christian school not far from where I live
24:48 and what happened in class in this school was a 14-year-old
24:54 girl fell down on the floor in class and went for two hours
24:59 exhibiting signs of demonic possession. The kids were
25:03 just amazed, they didn't know what was going on. The teacher
25:05 was amazed. They started praying for this girl and two hours
25:08 later the spirit left her and she returned to her sanity.
25:11 Come to find out a lot of the kids in the school were reading
25:14 Twilight and some were experimenting in the occult.
25:16 So this school board chairman called me and said, Steve, can
25:19 you come and talk to our kids? Because you know about the
25:21 occult and we want you to talk to them. So I came. We went
25:24 through some Bible scriptures, talked about Mark 5 about the
25:28 legion of demons that had entered into this man and how he
25:31 was cutting himself and doing all kinds of things, which, by
25:34 the way, is another practice that's growing among teenagers.
25:36 It's called cutting where they are compelled to cut themselves
25:39 and to draw blood and it was going on with all these kids.
25:44 You know the one thing I learned from Sherie Peters was that once
25:46 they begin cutting it really does release endorphins and
25:51 it becomes an addiction. That's exactly right, it becomes
25:53 an addiction just like Twilight has become an addiction. It's an
25:56 obsession, it's a craze. It's very easy to be fascinated by
26:01 blood and then to be wanting to check out blood and then to
26:04 eventually try blood and then to become addicted to blood.
26:07 In my little book, I document that there's a dark side to
26:10 vampirism, a real dark side. I mean, the whole thing to me is
26:13 dark, but even when they say it's kind of sort of like white
26:16 vampirism, it's very easy to go from the white to the dark and
26:19 to actually get involved in crimes and there are documented
26:23 of people who have murdered for blood. They call themselves
26:26 vampires and they kill people. You know, I don't focus on that
26:30 much in the book but I just mention it briefly with a little
26:33 bit of documentation to help the readers know that this is a real
26:39 dangerous trend in our society and we're trying to help kids
26:41 to get away from it, as far away as possible.
26:43 If someone wanted to get your little pocket book, The Darkness
26:46 of Twilight, what is your website?
26:50 Yes, we have one main website which is avoidtwilight.com.
26:54 It's easy to remember: avoidtwilight.com.
26:58 And we have a phone number: 800-78Bible for those who don't
27:01 have internet access. It's just a little tiny book. When the
27:04 Twilight movie came out people have been buying this book by
27:07 the hundreds at a time, giving them out at theaters, giving
27:10 them to their friends, giving them out at youth groups and it
27:13 is just a little resource to open people's eyes to the
27:17 dangers of the occult, the dangers of Twilight and to point
27:20 people ultimately to Jesus Christ, his shed blood, his
27:22 death on the cross, his resurrection and his desire to
27:25 come into our lives, into our hearts and to change us and give
27:28 us the power that the occult really can't give us.
27:31 Amen. Well you know they try to differentiate between dark magic
27:37 and white magic or white vampirism.
27:40 It's a convenient separation.
27:41 There is no separation as far as God is concerned
27:44 That's right. Not in the Bible.
27:46 Okay. Steve we want you to come back so that we can kind of go
27:49 into this a little bit further. Thank you so much for being here
27:53 today. Sure, you're very welcome.
27:55 You know, the Bible tells us that we have been bought with
27:59 a price and that price is the precious blood of Jesus and that
28:04 is the blood that we should put our focus on because there is
28:08 our salvation. I pray that this program has been eye-opening
28:12 for you. Thanks for joining us