Participants: John Lomacang (Host), Carol Zarska
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000369
00:01 ¤ ¤
00:29 Hello friends and welcome to 3ABNs Issues and Answers.
00:33 My name is John Lomacang and it's always good to have you
00:36 tune in and discover that whatever the issue Jesus is, in
00:40 fact, the answer. We have Carol Zarska with us today who's going
00:44 to bring to us a wonderful topic If you are married or even if
00:47 you are single you may have the concept in your mind that men
00:51 are from Mars and woman are from Venus. We're going to talk about
00:54 male and female communication. So let's welcome our guest at
00:58 this time. Carol so good to have you here.
00:59 It's good to be here. I'm so glad that I'm able to join
01:03 together with you today John.
01:05 You know what's so nice about it, we have a male and female
01:07 communication. I'm a male, you're a female so we'll be able
01:10 to see it from both angles. Yeah, that's very good.
01:13 You are a speaker and a family counselor. Yes. And a person who
01:18 has been really in ministry for a number of years. Just give us
01:22 a brief overview of what you've been doing for the Lord, or
01:26 should I say what the Lord has been doing through you.
01:28 Since 1984 I've been a public speaker. My major impetus in the
01:36 beginning was the sanctuary which led me into more
01:39 understanding about relationships because the
01:41 sanctuary as we understand it experientially is an example of
01:47 how God wants to teach us to interact with himself through
01:52 prayer because the sanctuary is a model for prayer, but it's
01:57 also a model since we were created in God's image, it's a
02:02 model for relationships with people as well. So I've been
02:05 learning more and more about that as the years have gone by
02:09 and it has been such an exciting journey to find out how God
02:13 wants to bring us back to wholeness.
02:15 I like the way you see that. The Lord wants to not only bring us
02:19 back to wholeness but he wants to communicate with us. I enjoy
02:22 studying the Bible and also teaching it and I've discovered
02:24 that Revelation, which is a book written in a lot of sanctuary
02:28 symbolism, you find the Lord says seven time, at least eight
02:33 times he who has an ear let him hear what the Spirit says. But
02:37 our focus today is what the Spirit is saying to the male and
02:40 to the female and then how the male and the female should
02:44 communicate together. What led you into looking into that
02:48 particularly? Well, number one I am a wife and
02:52 a mother and my husband and I have been married for 50 years
02:58 and so we've had a lot of practice on both sides.
03:01 I like that. And since I have been a family
03:06 counselor for years I thought that I had it pretty much
03:13 together. I thought I knew what I needed to know about not only
03:17 my own relationship with my husband but also teach other
03:21 people. And for quite some time it seemed to work out fine. But
03:27 in the last, I would say, five years I began to notice that
03:34 my relationship with my husband wasn't faring as well. It seemed
03:39 that no matter hard I tried and how nice I was, it seemed that
03:44 he was being more irritable. I tried to reach out to him and I
03:49 thought I was being such a good wife and doing all the things
03:53 that I was teaching other people about how to be kind and be
03:58 affirming and all those things. But it still wasn't working. It
04:03 got to the place where I began to wonder if my husband was
04:07 getting Alzheimer's or whatever because we are getting older.
04:12 My husband is 71 now, but at the time we were nearing 70 and I
04:18 thought well maybe something's wrong with his mind. So it
04:22 seemed like every day it was some kind of irritation and I
04:26 would say something. For example a little conversation; he'd say
04:31 I wonder where my keys are, can't find my keys. And I would
04:34 say well where did you put them last? And he would say if I knew
04:39 where I put them last, I would go and get them. And I would
04:42 say well honey I'm just trying to be helpful. And he would say
04:47 well you're not being helpful because if you say silly things
04:50 like that then how can that be helpful. So why don't you help
04:55 me find my keys. I would say well OK honey, I will and pretty
04:58 soon he would find his keys but he was already irritated by the
05:02 whole conversation. You know, I'm smiling because my
05:05 wife and I have had that conversation before and her
05:08 reply was the same thing, where did you put them last and I
05:11 recall saying the same thing to her, where did you put it last,
05:14 because sometimes she rushing out of the house and switching
05:19 pocketbooks and all that. So we see that not all women are very
05:22 far apart and I think that one of the things that you alluded
05:26 to before the program began was, and I want you to build on this,
05:29 is that men and women communicate quite differently.
05:34 Talk to me about that.
05:36 Yes, and I knew that but I didn't know that I was doing
05:41 anything wrong by being helpful and that's why I was blaming my
05:45 husband in my heart, it must be him, something's wrong with him.
05:50 And of course after any kind of hard or difficult or irritating
05:55 conversation then my husband would leave and I would feel
05:58 very devastated because I wanted
06:02 to have smooth communications and kisses at the door and
06:05 things like that and when he would be in that kind of a mood
06:08 he would just go and not even say goodbye and I would cry for
06:13 a couple of hours or whatever. It was to the place where I
06:17 finally said Lord, I have to have new light. I thought I knew
06:22 everything and something is wrong. I asked the Lord to show
06:27 me what to do to make our lives more happy. Well I need to tell
06:32 a little bit of a story about how God led me to understand how
06:36 to talk to my husband in a way that we never have any more
06:41 arguments, anymore. Now before you tell me, you know
06:43 what's so nice about this. You have, as you said, been married
06:47 for 50 years and what's so encouraging about what you're
06:50 admitting to or even talking about right now is that we can
06:54 always learn no matter how long we've been married. There's
06:57 always room to learn how to communicate better.
07:00 Right. I feel that God since he knows everything is the place we
07:06 have to go because I already had studied so much and thought I
07:12 knew so much. But God had something special for me that
07:16 I've been able to share now in the last three years that has
07:20 changed my marriage and changed a lot of others as I've been
07:25 able to share this. One day I was alone in the house and it
07:31 was Friday and I sat down in my chair about sundown and since
07:37 I was alone and that's rather rare because I'm always
07:40 surrounded with people, I decided I would do something
07:45 special. So I went to the big glass doors in our home and
07:49 looked out as the sun was going down on Friday evening. I said
07:54 Lord I'm all alone and so I'm going to come and invite you in
07:59 to my home this evening and you and I can have a nice Sabbath
08:05 evening together. So I did a little ritual of inviting him
08:10 and then I went over to my chair and sat down and talked to the
08:15 Lord and studied and prayed and so forth. Well several days
08:18 after that I was again talking to the Lord about my husband and
08:23 my relationship with my husband and God spoke to me in my heart
08:27 and in my mind and he said do you remember the other night
08:32 when you invited me into your home and you came to the door
08:37 and invited me in and we had a loving relationship that
08:41 evening? And I said yes and he said well I want you to do that
08:46 same thing every time your husband walks through that door.
08:52 And I thought, that's what I said, Mmm. Because after you're
08:57 married 50 years I didn't always jump up and run to the door and
09:01 give my husband a big kiss. I'd say hi honey or something like
09:05 that and keep on with what I was doing. The routine. The routine.
09:09 But the Lord began to teach me that I needed to treat my
09:13 husband with more respect first of all, that he is a king. God
09:19 made him that way. The Lord began to show me how when he
09:22 created Adam and Eve that Adam was a king. Now Eve was a Queen
09:28 but the Queen is not the same as the King even though it is equal
09:33 It's a submission of equals and how to treat one another and I
09:37 didn't know that. I treated him the same way I treated everybody
09:41 else, except of course I loved him as my husband. So I began to
09:45 do that. So when he would come I would go to the door and give
09:48 him a hug and a kiss and I would say honey are you hungry? Is
09:53 there anything I can do for you? Would you like for me to run the
09:57 bath water for you or what can I do for you? And he's like
10:02 stunned or whatever. But he got used to it and he liked it.
10:06 So now when he comes home I meet him at the door, I feed him and
10:12 I talk with him. Step number two That in itself is not enough.
10:18 Step number two is the Lord began to teach me that I was not
10:24 communicating to my husband in a proper way. Now I knew from
10:30 studies that have come out in scientific circles today that
10:34 the brains of a man and a woman function somewhat differently.
10:42 That men have more testosterone and men have more comfort level
10:49 in what is called left hemisphere of the brain
10:52 which is more where there's authority and there is action,
10:58 there are rules and regulations and time orientation and where
11:05 there's not as much talking as women can do. It is said that
11:10 men want to talk about 20,000 words a day and women 50,000
11:16 words a day. Wow. So that's quite a disparity. I would say.
11:21 And so the Lord began to impress me don't talk to him the way you
11:26 do your girlfriends which is just talk, talk. As soon as he
11:29 comes in the house, Oh honey you know what happened today and I'm
11:32 telling him all about my day and all this kind of stuff. The Lord
11:35 said let him talk first. He is the one that needs to unload
11:42 whatever he wants to. That moment of time when he and you
11:49 are together you put him first. So I began to do that. Then step
11:54 number three was that the Lord began to show me that I was not
11:59 speaking to him correctly; that I was being motherly, that I was
12:04 telling him what to do, that I would give him advice. So I'm
12:10 going to use a little conversation that started us on
12:16 a completely new track. Whenever I would say things to my husband
12:22 that were a little preachy, teachy, motherly the way I would
12:26 speak to my child perhaps, and say why don't you do it this way
12:31 or why are you doing it that way. How about this or giving
12:35 him suggestions and he would say what are you trying to do, be
12:38 the boss? And I'm saying no I'm not trying to be the boss. So
12:41 we would go off into these conversations.
12:42 Or specifically as a counselor. Sometimes I've said this in
12:46 doing marriage seminars. As a marriage counselor I say the
12:50 worst thing you can do is try to be the counselor of your spouse.
12:53 Exactly. You know, giving them advice. I can imagine how two
12:57 lawyers must be, both of them practicing law, you know they
13:01 hold their own, they have skills to argue down to the final
13:05 closing argument. But so you saw in your relationship that your
13:09 communication was, well if I'm hearing you carefully, it was
13:13 somewhat condescending to him to put yourself in the position
13:17 of authority over him, to give him advice and he's kind of
13:20 saying are you trying to be my mother?
13:22 Exactly, exactly. But I didn't know that I was doing that. To
13:26 a woman, a woman doesn't feel like I'm trying to be the mother
13:30 We just try to think it is a suggestion. That's how we feel
13:34 about it. If we're talking to another woman, when I suggest
13:38 something to another woman if she doesn't like it she just says oh
13:42 well thanks, you know, whatever and goes by her way. But what a
13:46 man generally feels is that a suggestion is more coming across
13:51 as a command and they feel like well you're trying to tell me
13:55 what to do. And a woman is like no I'm just giving you a
14:00 suggestion. But what I learned is that a man's mind is by God
14:06 given so that he wants to do something about what we bring
14:10 to him as a woman and so we have to be careful about that just
14:15 like Esther. She was very careful how she approached
14:18 Ahasuerus. She did it the right way. She didn't just come
14:23 bouncing into the throne room and begin to tell him all about
14:27 her problems. She did it very carefully. She fed him twice and
14:31 she give him an opportunity to ask what is it that you want and
14:36 all of that. So the Lord was teaching me this for about six
14:40 months but I would do it wrong every time. He would say well
14:45 you could have said it this way, you could have said it another
14:49 way. And I'd think oh OK I'll try to do that next time but
14:51 next time I would do it wrong again and my husband was
14:54 irritated again. The first time I did it right was on a Sabbath
14:59 afternoon and he was lying on the couch and I was sitting in
15:03 my chair and he began to tell me about some of his problems
15:07 at work. And he was saying they're telling me (my husband
15:12 is at this time a trucker) and he was saying they told me lies
15:15 and they said they were going to pay me this much and they
15:18 didn't really pay me that much and I think they're just trying
15:22 to steal from me. Well my first instinct was to say oh honey
15:26 they're probably not. They just made a mistake maybe. Maybe
15:30 they're not really trying to steal from you. So this is the
15:34 motheringly role. I'm trying to calm him down and make him feel
15:39 better. Well in the past that would make him more angry. It's
15:43 like well how do you know? What are you trying to tell me? You
15:47 don't know whether this is the truth or not.
15:49 Well are you on their side or my side?
15:51 Exactly. Whose side are you taking here? And I'm like I'm
15:55 not taking anybody's side, I'm just making a suggestion. No.
16:01 So anyway this time I said Lord I know I'm going to do it wrong
16:05 because I can't think what to do. I can't think what to say.
16:10 I want to say all these motherly things, it's instinct to me.
16:14 So I mumbled something about well maybe... and he said what'd
16:19 you say? He's hard of hearing. He said what'd you say?
16:22 Fortunately he's hard of hearing because it gave me time to pray
16:28 and I prayed and finally I said to him, Honey it must feel bad
16:34 to think that somebody has lied to you or stolen from you. And
16:39 all of a sudden there was quiet. Nothing was said. And all of a
16:43 sudden then he jumped up from where he was lying on the couch,
16:47 went into the kitchen, pulled in a chair, got as close to me as
16:50 he could, looked in my face with tears running down his face.
16:54 He said you are the most wonderful woman I have ever met.
16:58 And I thought what did I do? But that was the beginning,
17:03 the beginning of me learning that I need to talk respectfully
17:08 to my husband. I need to help him to feel that I understand,
17:12 that I'm not trying to tell him what to do, that I'm not
17:15 counseling him. I'm listening, I'm caring, I'm saying positive
17:20 things that encourage and build him up and make him feel more
17:24 like a man.
17:25 That is such a wonderful, and I won't use the word concept,
17:30 but approach that I believe and I'm saying this in the context
17:35 of counseling other people. Sometimes there are women in
17:39 relationships that are not necessarily domineering, they're
17:44 necessarily the type A. But in their multiple suggestions it
17:48 doesn't affirm or even take into consideration what the husband
17:54 has just said. For example, in fear of not being supportive but
18:00 wanting to give advice or maybe a third viewpoint. I think that
18:07 what you did just a moment ago is you affirmed that he was
18:10 saying to him was legitimate. To him it was legitimate. That's
18:14 all that matters to me as to how I'm to respond to him. Not tell
18:18 him what I think he ought to be thinking.
18:21 Oh, amazing. I will shake your hand right now. Can I do that?
18:26 Because I recently did a marriage seminar and I said to
18:30 the couples the think that is most offensive to male or female
18:34 is if the husband or wife says to the other one, I know what
18:39 you're thinking. You don't know what they're thinking.
18:40 No, not at all. Or sometimes we second guess
18:43 them and after we say something we say I know exactly what
18:45 you're going to say. No you don't know exactly what I'm
18:48 going to say. And so you saw that in action, affirming
18:51 exactly what the Lord was saying to you. Don't second guess him
18:55 or her. Don't think for them and I think sometimes the
18:58 husband would say are you trying to put words in my mouth.
19:02 That's right, they would say that, and he did say things like
19:05 that and it always was astounding to me. I never
19:09 thought that what I was doing. That's why I had to go to the
19:12 Lord and say, Lord I am done. I don't know what I'm doing wrong.
19:16 I thought I was being nice. I tried to be nice all the time.
19:20 And I wasn't being nice because I wasn't speaking his language.
19:23 I was speaking my language but it wasn't getting anything
19:28 across to him about my love for him and my understanding of him.
19:32 So now we have wonderful conversations and I never ever
19:38 say anything negative to my husband, ever, not one time.
19:42 Praise the Lord. And my husband has been a totally different
19:47 person now. Before, because I'm so spiritual, I have had a
19:52 spiritual walk with the Lord and I'm a spiritual person out in
19:56 public and all that sort of thing, he didn't take any action
20:00 so far as leadership in the family to be a spiritual leader.
20:04 And every Christian woman always says well I want my husband to
20:08 be the priest of the house and he's not. My husband wasn't
20:12 and I found out that it was because he felt that I was
20:16 better than him. But now I uphold him, I give him
20:22 encouragement all the time about everything that he does
20:26 and he is becoming extremely spiritual. We talk about God all
20:30 the time. He loves God so much now, he talks about him. He
20:35 weeps about God. When he's singing songs his tears are
20:39 coming down on his face because he's thinking about how much he
20:43 loves God. That has never happened before.
20:45 Let me ask you this question because this is fascinating when
20:48 it comes to communicating. We talk about communicating with
20:51 women. Don't communicate to your husband what you communicate to
20:53 your girlfriends. No. And I think the husband would say
20:56 the same thing. Don't talk to your male friends like you speak
20:58 to your wife. But what I'm hearing you say is it took a
21:03 number of years for you to come to this realization. Yes it did.
21:06 But you were willing, you were willing to be taught by God.
21:10 I felt that if I didn't understand how to get along with
21:14 my husband that I was not fulfilling the calling that God
21:18 had given to me to be helping other people, and I'm not even
21:22 making it myself. So I felt I can't disappoint God. I can't
21:27 disappoint my husband and my children because the children,
21:31 even thought my children are in their 40s, they're looking still
21:35 to mom and dad to see how mom and dad are getting along. And
21:39 they are ecstatic because we're having such a wonderful
21:43 relationship and they are learning, I have two girls and a
21:46 boy, and they're learning how to do the same kind of
21:49 communication. They can teach it as well as I can now.
21:53 You know what's nice about that is that as they are getting
21:55 older, whether they are married or not you didn't say, but as
21:57 they're getting older they see what a successful relationship
22:01 is, what a successful marriage is. I've heard this and I'm sure
22:04 you've heard that people often say, and my wife and I have been
22:08 married 25 years, and some people say Ah they probably
22:10 finish each other's sentences. Somebody once said to me you
22:13 can't teach an old dog new tricks. OK now I'm saying don't
22:17 call me an old dog, I've just been married 25 years. But what
22:21 I'm seeing here is that the willing heart is the place that
22:25 could always learn something new and that's what you discovered.
22:30 Mm-huh, I certainly did. And I would tell anybody that it
22:33 doesn't matter how old you are or how young. This is something
22:37 that we can learn and it is something we must learn if we
22:40 want to learn how to communicate the way God does because God is
22:45 not negative. God is positive. He is a God who wants to
22:50 encourage us all the time and to help us learn how to relate to
22:55 each other. It's only Satan that has us speaking meanly to one
22:59 another. It's the work of the evil one to destroy families
23:04 from the time it in the garden of Eden with Adam and Eve, from
23:08 the time they broke apart in their relationship to whatever
23:14 extent. Then we have 6000 years of this on us on television and
23:19 everything it seems it's OK to be nasty and snippy with each
23:23 other and to tear each other down. So there's no model now
23:28 for people unless we Christians learn how in our own families
23:33 to be good to one another and then we can pass it on to others
23:38 and I'm able to do that now and see marriages turn around and
23:42 put back together that were broken marriages. So it's a time
23:48 of repair and healing I believe just like it says in Malachi 4
23:52 that the end time God is going to rise with healing in his
23:57 wings. That's right. And then he's
23:59 going to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children and the
24:01 hearts of the children to the fathers. There's a
24:03 reconciliation that's going to be taking place.
24:05 Absolutely and our family is where it should start, right
24:11 there in the family. One time an older woman asked me, her
24:17 husband was deceased at that time, and she asked me do you
24:22 think that if I had had the kind of communication and treatment
24:27 of my husband that you do to your husband now, do you think
24:33 that my husband could have escaped being mentally ill?
24:38 I knew the couple and I said, I believe that that could have
24:43 been true because we drive each other to the pain that causes
24:48 mental illness, not feeling loved, not feeling accepted, not
24:54 feeling known or that anybody out there is understanding us.
24:59 If it should be anywhere it should be in the family where we
25:04 do this for one another.
25:06 So the internal combustion or frustration of lack of
25:09 communication of feeling misunderstood or not accepted
25:14 we're like a bottle of soda that's been shaken, shaken and
25:18 shaken and there's nowhere to release that fizz so to speak of
25:22 frustration. So we internally combust which sometimes means
25:27 mental illness. It can mean mental illness, yes.
25:29 Because a person has nowhere else to go and the mind breaks
25:32 down under the pressure.
25:34 So now today if somebody looking at this program would
25:39 say Carol are you telling me that it's still not too late for
25:42 me to learn how to communicate with my wife or with my husband
25:45 what are you saying to them?
25:46 I would say it doesn't matter what age you are, it doesn't
25:50 matter what your experience has been in the past, God can heal
25:54 that but there are steps to it. Some people say well all you
25:58 have to do is just pray. Well yes we do have to pray, but
26:02 there's some intelligent ways of learning that help God to help
26:07 us that we know how to do it. It's just like saying all I have
26:12 to do if I'm sick is just pray. Well that can work and
26:15 sometimes healing does take place that way. But God also
26:19 expects us to understand the laws of the mind, the laws of
26:23 the body and to cooperate with those laws. Then healing can
26:27 take place. We're in a wonderful time in history where God is
26:31 allowing much light to come to our generation that was never
26:35 understood by any other generation.
26:38 I'm so encouraged because my wife and I just hit the 25-year
26:40 mark and you said you and your husband are at 50 years. I'm
26:43 encouraged to know that it could get better. I mean we have
26:45 a fantastic relationship but it could better.
26:49 Yes because God is infinite and his ways are past finding out
26:53 and he wants nothing but joy for us. I want to encourage
27:00 anybody to look more into this because this is just a drop in
27:03 the bucket because there is so much more to learn. I'm sure
27:07 that you find that in what you do and I find it in what I do
27:10 that there's more to learn and we can help on another toward
27:14 the kingdom with our families intact.
27:16 I know that people watching and listening to the program are
27:19 saying this is eye opening to me because I thought that I had
27:22 all the angles covered, I thought that I had great
27:24 communication. After all I love him, he loves me, but gentlemen
27:29 husband or wife, if you're watching the program today or
27:32 young person planning to get married, do what Carol did. Say
27:35 Lord teach me, guide me, and help me to understand the way
27:38 to be better than I have been to this point. And as we say here
27:42 at 3ABN you know the Lord has something for you to do. You can
27:46 begin today and so friends, whatever the issue, don't
27:49 forget that God has the answer. Thank you so much for tuning in.