Participants: Dwain Esmond, Karen Thomas
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000058
00:30 Welcome to Issues and Answers.
00:32 It's great to have you with us again for another program.
00:34 And for you children who are watching this program will say,
00:37 is there something Issues and Answers for children?
00:39 Yes, today there is.
00:42 Our topic today is money skills for kids,
00:45 something for children, parents, grandparents,
00:48 anyone who has children
00:50 and who wants to learn or who is a child
00:52 and who wants to learn more about how to manage money.
00:55 We're here today talking with Dwain Esmond,
00:58 he is the associated editor for the Message Magazine
01:01 which is a part of their Review and Herald publishing.
01:03 And he is accomplished academician.
01:08 He has an English Literature degree from Oakwood College
01:12 and a master degree in English
01:13 from Pittsburg State University.
01:15 Welcome to the program, Dwayne.
01:17 Thank you for having me again. Good to have you back again.
01:19 Now how all of that qualifies me to talk about
01:22 money skills for kids, I have no idea.
01:24 But we're gonna stretch and make it work today.
01:28 No, you wrote a book now I understand
01:30 that's "Beyond the In-A-Pinch God."
01:32 So pinching pennies is also value isn't it?
01:35 Well, little bit about pinching, yes.
01:36 I would know a little bit about that.
01:38 But this money issue, especially involving children
01:42 is something that people ask us about
01:46 especially when they write
01:47 and we have a new column in the magazine called,
01:49 "Let's Talk" which is kind of a parenting column,
01:52 it also deals with relationship issue
01:56 and people often write in and ask about you know,
02:00 hey, how do I get my kids you know, to do such and such
02:03 or to stop begging and you know being very, very--
02:06 Yeah, asking for money for tours.
02:08 Yes. Now how do I do that?
02:11 So we-- we've been trying to kind of meet that need
02:15 and provide some skills
02:17 and I don't want to just talk about the skills
02:20 and there's something that we talk about more importantly,
02:22 what did kind of principles and kind of standards
02:26 that you want to establish for them to evaluate
02:29 how they use this resource.
02:32 Okay, we'll see I have my note book here
02:34 and I'm ready to take some notes
02:36 because I have ten-year-old and eight-year-old.
02:38 Now, I think you should be doing this not me.
02:42 But actually can I begin by reading a scripture
02:47 that I think is very important?
02:49 It's found
02:50 in the Book of Philippians 4:11.
02:58 The Bible says here,
02:59 the apostle Paul is speaking again,
03:01 "Not that I speak in respect of want for I have learned,
03:06 in whatever state I am, therewith to be content.
03:11 I know both how to be abased,
03:13 and I know how to abound every where and in all things
03:17 I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry,
03:20 both to abound and to suffer need."
03:24 And then verse 13,
03:25 the one that we enjoy according so much,
03:28 "I can do all things through Christ which strengthens me."
03:34 We tend to remove verse 13 from the context a little bit
03:39 but the context is, I know how
03:42 or I have learned where God has shown me
03:45 how to be content where I am and in whatever state I am.
03:49 To me it says that Paul understands
03:51 that God owns everything
03:55 and that God apportions things according to His own will
03:59 and at sometimes my portion won't be big
04:02 but it maybe smaller than usual
04:04 and then at other times it may have a lot.
04:07 But in whatever stayed I've learned
04:08 that God is in control of it all
04:10 and that I'm gonna be okay.
04:12 I want to begin there because that to me
04:16 is the essential principle and standard
04:21 that parents must try to somehow
04:24 get across to their children,
04:26 to learn that God is in control of everything
04:29 and how to be content and to abound also.
04:35 You got that? Yeah, we got that.
04:39 All right, what's next? Money skills.
04:44 I should probably begin by talking about myself.
04:46 I remember as a kid,
04:47 my mother used to go to the grocery store
04:50 and buy my tender shoes for school.
04:53 Now I had like a bunch of friends and every kid is
04:58 probably had this, who had everything.
05:00 You know they had that nice shoes that were in it,
05:02 the Nike shoes or the Adidas or whatever
05:05 and I remember man, she would go there
05:07 and my shoes will be in a big bin you know
05:11 and she'd have to find one side
05:14 and then dig around and route around
05:16 and there find another side and it was traumatic.
05:18 I'm laughing because I remember though.
05:20 I mean that is, that is--
05:21 All the tender shoes that has little whites on the top of it.
05:24 Yes. Oh you remember that.
05:26 So when I went to school everybody knew
05:29 where I got my shoes from.
05:31 And I remember just feeling like, man, when I get older
05:34 and I get to hold of some money I'm just gonna buy
05:37 that most expensive, that most in shoe
05:40 that I could find and I did that.
05:42 You know, when I started working as a teenager
05:44 or whatever you know, all my money was just going to things
05:47 and I was thinking to myself you know lately,
05:51 Dwain, some of the habits that you have now,
05:54 that you're struggling to break financially bad habits,
05:58 bad financial practices began when you were child.
06:02 You know because you perhaps
06:03 wanted something that you could not have.
06:06 So that started me thinking and then with the questions
06:10 that we get from parents and guardians
06:12 sometimes is that you know,
06:13 there must be a need out there and how do we equip parents?
06:17 So how do you communicate something like,
06:20 contentment to your child?
06:22 Any ideas?
06:25 Contentment in my estimation,
06:29 say for instance if your child wants something
06:32 that's extremely important to them.
06:38 Something that may cost a little bit.
06:40 I think it's important to not only have the child work
06:44 and somehow contribute to that thing,
06:46 I think that's a very important principle.
06:48 But I think it's also important to perhaps steer kids
06:53 in the direction of toys or things
06:58 that they purchase being more interactive,
07:01 something that they could not only enjoy for today
07:04 but that they will learn to enjoy
07:06 and create other uses for in the future.
07:10 And I think some parents--
07:15 and parents you know, I want to be clear here,
07:17 parents have a tough job as it is.
07:21 They are working hard,
07:22 they are trying to make ends meet
07:24 so I don't even want to,
07:26 someone who is not even a parent yet, who am I?
07:28 I'm not qualified to tell parents what to do.
07:30 I bet you grew up.
07:31 But I think I understand growing up.
07:34 I could speak through that, right?
07:37 I think it's important that parents give the children
07:40 or allow their kids to get things
07:43 and learn how to be creative with the things that they have.
07:49 And you know, its, you can buy things at different stages
07:53 but if they have everything right now
07:55 they will never learn the issue or the principle of contentment
08:00 because as we know things make us want more things.
08:04 You'll never satisfy by the things that you get.
08:07 By the way, adults are the same way.
08:09 I wonder where they got it from?
08:11 Where do they get it from? Where do we get from?
08:12 Where do we get that from?
08:14 But the same kind of principle holds so one of that--
08:16 Being creative. Being creative.
08:18 So now give us an example of way
08:23 that to teach children or that children
08:27 who maybe watching the program could develop this contentment,
08:32 by they having some future use.
08:33 I have, I have two nephews
08:38 and one of them is extremely creative.
08:43 He has a very creative fertile mind.
08:46 And he has these play things that he enjoys,
08:49 some of the kids might even recognize
08:52 this building set is called connects.
08:55 And kids, I mean kids
08:58 must love this stuff and he loves it.
09:00 He can make all kinds of different things with that.
09:03 I mean, he can make trucks
09:05 and he can make airplanes and he can--
09:07 you know, kind of like building blocks on steroids
09:10 you know, you can do everything with this stuff.
09:12 Now he is, he can get everything
09:18 and I'm glad that, you know, he's not able to get everything
09:23 because he has learned
09:24 and his little brother is learning
09:27 how to be creative with the sets that they have.
09:30 Now after a while he have--
09:33 Yeah, those connects or not cheap.
09:35 They are not cheap.
09:37 So if you're gonna buy them one every week, okay.
09:40 You'd be out of luck. You'd be in a poor house, okay.
09:42 But he has learned
09:45 how to create different things over time
09:48 and as he grows and as his mind matures
09:51 they get more complex and that's the kind of gift
09:53 I'm talking about something
09:55 that increases his capacity for creativity
09:58 and that capacity will help them in future.
10:00 Well it's quite better than get in a bunch of little matched
10:03 box toys or cars, maybe for two bucks
10:07 and you would get into something may be there
10:11 though it maybe more money on the front end of it.
10:14 He's gonna have hours of creativity
10:15 that much from there.
10:16 Hours, days and you won't have to worry about
10:20 you know, next week till he is tired of it
10:23 and throwing into the side
10:24 and this also points out another important thing here
10:28 and that's that some kids have different temperaments.
10:31 So not, not every child will you know,
10:34 want to be creative all the time
10:36 but because of the world in which we live,
10:38 a world that now values creativity
10:42 and adoptability in focus on careers
10:47 and that sort of thing you have to be flexible.
10:50 I think that's an important skill
10:52 in addition to the contentment which is learned
10:54 that's an important skill to communicate to kids today.
10:58 That's one way I think to teach contentment.
11:01 Another principle I take that has to be taught
11:04 is the principle of sharing.
11:09 I grew up-- Very important skill.
11:12 I grew up in a family, now I have three elder brothers
11:16 and I have a baby sister, she is the youngest, four,
11:20 she has four older brothers.
11:23 I feel sorry for her
11:25 but its like sharing was something
11:29 that we had to learn, we didn't have much.
11:32 So my oldest brother would get a shirt
11:37 and it would come all the way down the line.
11:39 I mean it would come down whether you want it or not
11:41 you know, it came down the line.
11:43 You knew you were gonna wear that shirt.
11:45 So if you let cool on him you hope
11:47 that it still had a print or a pattern
11:49 when it got to you.
11:51 You know, because it'd be washed out and whatever
11:53 but you were kind of forced to learn this thing of sharing
11:57 but when you became independent,
12:01 had your own stuff, you know,
12:05 I wasn't always ready to be as sharing oriented because now
12:11 I was tired of just getting things that were not mine.
12:13 So when I got of hold of something that was mine,
12:15 it's mine and that's it.
12:17 But one of the great ways
12:19 I think parents can teach kids about the value
12:23 and the ability to use money for good
12:26 is through sharing projects
12:28 that churches maybe involved with.
12:31 When you know, someone stands up or in front and says
12:35 we have a need in the church or our community has a need
12:38 and we would like to contribute to it
12:40 often the kids get divorced from that process.
12:46 The parents and the adults take over.
12:50 They give the money.
12:54 They put the money in and in essence
12:56 we miss an opportunity with the kids
12:58 because if you are per say giving them an allowance
13:03 you can teach them to designate
13:06 some of that allowance for their children.
13:09 I mean for this need
13:10 some of their allowance for their special need
13:13 that the church or the community is having.
13:15 And so doing it we teach the principle of service
13:18 and you teach the principle of sharing
13:20 and you teach the principle that God owns everything
13:23 and that is not all mine
13:26 which I think is extremely important.
13:28 So the idea of connecting an allowance
13:31 is something that the child can plan on,
13:33 may stop some of the spontaneous
13:36 requesting in the store you know,
13:37 you're giving so much every week or whatever.
13:41 Which is a terrific skill for, easily learned.
13:47 You know, if you give your kids a very simple allowance,
13:51 incidentally I found out, now this is interesting,
13:55 in Michigan, I think it's the Michigan area
14:00 kids get some of the highest allowances in the nation.
14:04 Now this is weird. Is that so?
14:05 I grew up in Michigan.
14:08 Did you get-- did you get--
14:09 Oh, what are we better bargain here?
14:10 Did you get $100, $150 a week? Oh, no, not.
14:14 Well, that's what kids are getting today.
14:16 Some kids are getting $100 a week.
14:21 But there are high incomes with the lot of you know
14:23 you got the all the dealerships
14:25 you know many factories that are there.
14:28 Some of the needs maybe, maybe a little different.
14:29 Well, a kids been a $150, you said a week?
14:32 Some of them get a $100 a week and I want to know
14:35 why their parents are not giving them more.
14:38 The spending power of this kids between the,
14:44 from, the cradle almost to about teenage hood
14:50 the spending power is over a $100 billion.
14:53 And that's counting-- that's just the money
14:55 that they have that's not counting
14:57 the influence that they exert on the families purchases.
15:02 Now that's a whole different bowl of wax, right?
15:07 I never quiet thought of it that way but it's true.
15:09 But when you go into a store with your children
15:12 they influence their nag, right.
15:15 I mean I'm talking about things I did.
15:16 And they used to put the request through,
15:19 well, as long as you are in this
15:21 then there is a famous pitch number into the basket.
15:25 You know and kids will not let you rest.
15:27 I mean, you go to the grocery store and you get in a,
15:29 you get in a cereal aisle, you know,
15:31 you could be in a cereal aisle for hours.
15:32 You know, they want this, this and this
15:35 and parents basically brake down and give in.
15:38 So if we're talking about teaching them these principles
15:42 maybe it'll save you some headache you know later on
15:45 but the kids have tremendous spending power today and they--
15:50 if you're giving them a consistent allowance
15:53 10% of that ought to go for tithe
15:57 and 10% of that ought to go for offering.
16:01 You know that's another thing it's not just tithe
16:04 but what-- the offerings, as my wife likes to say,
16:08 my wife is a finance Google type person
16:10 so she says to me the offering demonstrates our love.
16:16 You know the tithes we return but the offering says
16:19 how much we love the Lord in a sense you know.
16:23 So to teach your kids not just how to tithe
16:26 but how to provide something for an offering
16:30 and then there's the issue of savings.
16:33 10% ought to go for savings.
16:37 This principle of paying yourself
16:40 is so important for kids to learn
16:44 because if you don't learn,
16:46 if you don't get into a consistent savings pattern
16:49 and we're told now in our society that
16:51 we don't even save 2% of our income.
16:56 Not even 2%.
16:58 Let alone 10% of our income
17:00 but we are maxed out 10 years ago,
17:05 credit card debts to that around $250 billion.
17:09 You have any idea what it is today?
17:12 It's about $750 billion that was just 10 years ago
17:17 and we are basically putting ourselves into the grave
17:21 because we have no grasp
17:25 of how to control our financial lives.
17:28 The Bible says, "Owe no man anything but love."
17:32 And in our society, yes, credit and that sort of thing
17:35 is kind of a necessary evil to some degree
17:38 but imagine if you taught your kids
17:41 that if you consistently save
17:45 and you were content with what you had
17:47 and you gave the Lord what was His,
17:50 imagine how much better of they might be later on at all.
17:55 So that's important.
17:56 That whole principle is extremely important.
18:00 The principle of thankfulness, for what God has given
18:06 whenever you give something to your children
18:10 whether it be money or not
18:13 I think the parent should gauge the thankfulness.
18:17 What is their response?
18:19 Do they say, mom, "Thank you very much."
18:22 Do they say, "Oh, good," and run off, you know,
18:28 are they thankful, will they come back and say, you know,
18:31 "Hey, that really thank you ma, I really needed that."
18:34 And you know kids learn these things over time
18:36 so we're not gonna expect the ten, five-year-old
18:38 or seven-year-old to come back with a deep, you know,
18:41 path holes in his voice thanking you.
18:44 You won't expect that but they do need to thank you
18:48 and they need to also realize
18:50 that mom and dad didn't get this
18:53 from the man at the place where they worked.
18:57 God is the person who supplies the needs in the home
19:02 and who will supply this amount of money that you can now have.
19:07 And what about that Bible example about the 10 lepers?
19:13 Nine ran away. Excellent example.
19:15 Excellent example. Nine ran away one came back.
19:20 And if I would dare say that the same ratio
19:23 holds in our society today most people are not thankful.
19:28 Because we always feel like we don't have enough.
19:31 What do I have to be thankful for?
19:33 One of the great skills that I think you can give your kids
19:36 is each week have them just, at the end of the week,
19:40 this could be a great little Friday night activity,
19:43 you just pull out a pad
19:44 and have them make a list of things
19:47 that happened this week that they are thankful for.
19:51 What are you thankful for this week?
19:54 You know, if and you may have to remind them,
19:58 you know, hey, do you remember that
19:59 I gave you $10, do you remember that?
20:02 It might be gone by now but do you remember that.
20:05 You know, in so doing they learn
20:10 to always remember that things
20:12 they will not take stuff they get for granted,
20:15 they will remember that these things
20:16 come from the Lord all the time.
20:19 So that's the thankfulness thing
20:21 is a great principle that they have to learn
20:26 and there is also the issue of teaching them
20:30 kind of how to deal with investments.
20:34 There are some people
20:37 who don't kind of share this view
20:40 and I respect that investment
20:42 is a principle that's in the Bible also.
20:45 I mean, we are told for instance
20:47 to take the talents that God gives us,
20:50 Ellen White even mentions the fact that talent is--
20:54 money is a talent that is to be used for God service
20:58 and that's the key to be used for God service.
21:02 You can meet your needs
21:04 but it's also to be used for God's service.
21:08 One of the very easy ways that kind of teach our kids
21:10 this principle is have them
21:12 perhaps start an investment club
21:15 where they can put, take little bits of money
21:19 and learn how to track socially responsible stocks.
21:25 For instance companies and these funds are out there,
21:28 they are mutual funds for kids and that's sort of thing.
21:31 I mean, you can go on any internet financial site
21:34 and they have them, where you can,
21:37 kids can learn the time value of money.
21:40 For instance, if you put money in over a period of time
21:44 it can grow and become something else.
21:47 That teaches them not only about their savings,
21:49 how their savings can grow but also how you know,
21:52 if you investing in certain companies
21:55 and if they do all over time
21:56 and again socially responsible investments.
22:00 We're not talking about companies that you know,
22:03 tobacco companies for instance
22:05 I would not recommend something like that.
22:07 You can find out what different mutual funds
22:10 hold in their portfolios, these kind of things
22:13 are kind of good for kids to learn
22:15 because this is the world and in which they live.
22:17 If you just kind of cloister them from it
22:20 I think you do them a little bit of disservice
22:23 even if you don't believe in it.
22:24 Now it makes me think about when we were,
22:26 when I was in a business school
22:27 they had us an exercise in it for students
22:29 do not have any money to invest or you know,
22:32 or maybe before we actually do
22:34 put the money somewhere either it was in land which you know,
22:38 a lot of people would prefer to put their money in the land
22:40 or into real estate or may be into business enterprise
22:44 that we would actually
22:45 take the Wall Street Journal out and do the math.
22:49 And you know, you maybe what to just have okay
22:51 I'm pretending that I have this much money
22:54 and does this look like a good investment
22:55 because people get so lured into you know
22:58 going into certain kinds of speculative investments
23:03 and then they have put the money in
23:04 before they've actually gone
23:05 through the exercise to the even see
23:08 you know, some wondering, you know.
23:10 Oh, absolutely.
23:12 The research piece that teaches you, you know,
23:16 how to track something before getting involved.
23:20 You know, I've, I think all of us
23:23 have been approached by people
23:25 who have some scheme that's gonna make you
23:28 a bunch of money in a short period of time.
23:31 Have you had that?
23:32 Offshore banking and other things from--
23:34 Oh, yeah.
23:35 All kinds of stuff, people have got
23:36 you know, this product--
23:37 Not that there is anything wrong
23:39 with offshore banking in other places, you want to say that?
23:41 No, not exactly wrong with that, okay.
23:43 There's a people are more speculative than magical.
23:46 Very, very speculative
23:47 and it's very challenging to navigate that
23:52 if you don't have the right skill set.
23:56 People are coming at you and they are saying
23:58 I've got this product, it's great.
24:01 We can multilevel market it
24:03 and we can make do-- we can make our live bets.
24:07 Some people don't know how to evaluate that,
24:12 that opportunity if you call it had.
24:16 And in so doing they lose their shirts
24:19 you know, they lose a lot of money and--
24:22 Even 401(k) plan
24:23 which people have on their business
24:25 in their some employers have they may say okay
24:28 we're gonna give you a 401(k) plan
24:31 and they're basically investing parts of that
24:35 into other these sort of pools or whatever.
24:36 Right and you've got to be careful
24:39 and be hands on to know for sure
24:42 you know, to be proactive
24:44 so that you know for sure that they are investing
24:46 where you want your money to go.
24:48 But if you think of a kid who's never been taught
24:53 these kind of financial skills attempting to--
24:56 How to run a business for example.
24:57 Yeah, to navigate something like that is just,
25:00 it's almost impossible.
25:02 So this is like essential equipment for life, I feel.
25:09 That sounds good to me.
25:10 As for review for those
25:12 who maybe just joined this program and progress,
25:16 God is in control is what you said.
25:19 And maybe you want to give us
25:20 some recap of what we talked about.
25:22 Well, I talked about the fact of that God
25:24 was in control of everything
25:25 and I mentioned the text Philippians 4
25:29 beginning in verse 11 and going to verse 13,
25:32 learning the essential principle of contentment
25:37 in whatever state that we are
25:39 and we talked a little bit about how we might be
25:41 able to communicate that to our children.
25:44 We also talked about sharing
25:46 the importance of that principle in everything
25:50 that you give your children
25:52 they ought to be some portion of it that,
25:55 you know, they set aside for someone else.
25:57 The principle of tithes and offering
25:59 that's an important consideration,
26:01 probably should be one of the highest one,
26:03 should be the first amount pulled out.
26:05 We talked about thankfulness.
26:08 Making sure engaging and encouraging activities
26:12 that kids where your children can look back and see
26:16 over the course of say a week or so
26:18 the things that God has done for them
26:20 not only financially but in other ways
26:22 where that they are thankful for.
26:25 Those were some of the principles
26:26 and skills that we try to communicate.
26:29 Well, for those of you who watch the program today
26:31 I hope you've learned something I know that I have
26:33 that I've taken careful notes but if for some reason
26:37 you didn't have your pen and paper handy
26:38 you can very much get a copy of the program today
26:41 by calling that 800 number on your screen
26:44 or you can also go to the website
26:46 and know more about these publications
26:48 Message Magazine and Insight.
26:50 The website is www.insightmagazine.org
26:54 this is a magazine dedicated to young people
26:57 to teach them about Christ as well as life skills
26:59 that we've talked about today and Message Magazine
27:02 there is a section in Message magazine
27:04 called message junior which highlights
27:06 a lot of nicknames for kids so to encourage.
27:10 A lot of these kinds of principles we talked.
27:12 Oh great and let's have a closing prayer
27:14 if you would please, doing.
27:17 Our Father and our God,
27:18 we thank You so much for this privilege of sharing
27:22 on an issue that is so important.
27:26 Lord, You gave us the resources,
27:29 everything on this planet is Yours
27:32 and we pray that we might be able to communicate
27:34 to our children to those around us
27:37 how to correctly use the resources
27:39 that You have gave us.
27:41 Bless us and keep us until You come
27:44 as I pray in Jesus name, amen.
27:47 Thank you so much for coming to our program today,
27:49 it's been a blessing.
27:51 And for those of you who've been watching at home
27:53 we hope it has been a blessing for you as well
27:55 and until next time have a great day.