Participants: Agatha Thrash (Host), Don Miller, Rhonda Clark
Series Code: HYTH
Program Code: HYTH000228
00:01 Hello! Few accomplishments are more
00:04 satisfying to the individual than victory over a bad habit
00:10 such as the habit of overeating, the habit of being overweight.
00:14 We'll be talking about overweight in this session
00:17 and we hope you will join us.
00:38 Welcome to Help Yourself to Health
00:41 with Dr. Agatha Thrash of Uchee Pines Institute,
00:44 and now here is your host Dr. Thrash.
00:47 There are many things that a person dreads
00:54 when they are overweight.
00:56 The first thing is they dread is facing the problem,
01:00 they dread thinking about having to loose weight
01:04 or wanting to loose weight.
01:05 Another thing that they dread is the complications
01:09 that may occur from being overweight.
01:11 Several of those skeletal problems, digestive problems,
01:15 diabetes may be a problem, emotional upsets,
01:21 may be a problem for some, so there are many problems
01:25 that can arise from being overweight.
01:27 Now we would like to talk with you about some of these
01:30 and the way that we approach loosing weight
01:35 can be a major problem for one or can be one that one takes
01:40 just in stride, so we would like to talk with you just a little
01:44 bit about how you can go about loosing weight.
01:48 What tips you can have, is there more than prayer,
01:52 is there more than study and commitment of yourself
01:56 to the Lord, can you do something yourself that can be
02:00 helpful, and I have asked Rhonda Clark to join me
02:03 Rhonda is a colleague at Uchee Pines, and I would like
02:07 to welcome you to the program today.
02:08 - Thank you! Glad to be here.
02:09 - And I know that some of the things that you and I will
02:12 talk about that people hear that they will be very pleased
02:17 with, so tell us a little bit about yourself.
02:20 Have you always been thin as you are now?
02:23 - And on my way to being thinner.
02:27 I started my adventure at Uchee Pines quite a bit heavier
02:31 than I am now, and am excited to share with you some tips
02:35 today that have been very beneficial to me personally
02:38 and that I know will help me on my journey to reach my goal
02:41 weight, which I hope will be within the year.
02:44 - That sounds good.
02:45 We know that overweight is a spiritual battle,
02:53 it's a battle that has to do with how I relate to the Lord
02:58 how I understand myself, what commitment I have to the Lord
03:05 for how I handle His equipment.
03:07 All of these things are spiritual things,
03:10 my relationship with other people, this also has to do
03:14 with my weight and my appetite, and the way that I enjoy eating
03:18 or I enjoy having meal times.
03:21 All of these have spiritual overtones,
03:26 but we also know that there are some physical things
03:30 that we can do, while I can commit myself to the Lord
03:34 I can through prayer admit that I am powerless against
03:39 the habit of indulging myself in things that are going to make
03:43 me overweight.
03:44 I can look at myself and I can understand that
03:48 I don't like the way that I am, and I can determine that I
03:53 am not going to eat a certain thing, and then I have found
03:57 that in the past that I do it anyway.
04:00 There are some things that I have found that can be helpful
04:04 that the Lord has recommended that we do,
04:07 and so I know that it is not wrong for us to try
04:12 to participate.
04:14 And sometimes in the way that people look at righteousness
04:21 by faith and being saved by grace and not by works,
04:26 we understand that those things are true and yet the Lord has
04:30 commanded us a number of things to do, one is,
04:32 you see evil and you flee from it, that's works,
04:39 but never the less it helps a lot of times.
04:42 Now there are some other things, I may not flee
04:47 the evil, but I can take the evil out of my house,
04:51 that's another tip.
04:53 What are some things that you have found?
04:56 You know one of the things I know that the Lord had inspired
04:59 that has been very helpful to me in my weight loss program
05:02 has been transitioning over to a two meal a day plan.
05:06 And there is still a part of me even after several months of
05:09 following this, that can't believe I'm only eating
05:12 breakfast and lunch, and not eating supper which
05:14 has habitually been for many people and was for me
05:17 my largest meal.
05:19 - Three square meals a day, I grew up with that,
05:22 that was the sign that you had been successful in life,
05:27 I've always had three square meals a day.
05:29 There is a saying in the area where I grew up,
05:33 so what did you think when you heard about the...
05:36 I remember when I studied about two meals, and that being the
05:40 ideal physiologic pattern for human beings,
05:45 I remember when we studied that in physiology in
05:49 medical school, I thought well that's strange because nobody
05:54 but nobody eats only tow meals a day.
05:57 I didn't realize that there were a lot of people who really did
06:00 eat only two meals a day, that is the two healthful meals.
06:04 Of course I guess that probably 4/5ths of the world only eats
06:08 two meals a day, but the wrong two, they eat a light lunch
06:11 and a huge supper, or what they call dinner,
06:15 but the best meal pattern for a human being, a good breakfast
06:19 and a good lunch.
06:20 What did you think about that when you first heard that plan?
06:24 - You know supper for me had been much more than just a third
06:28 evening meal, for me it began when I came home from work
06:32 and was somewhat of a meal and kind of transitioned into
06:35 snacking in front of the television the rest of the
06:37 evening, even up until bedtime.
06:39 And so giving up my third meal, I was giving up more than
06:42 just a meal, I was giving up my source of relaxation,
06:45 I was giving up my entertainment in the evening, I was giving up
06:48 something a little bigger to me personally.
06:50 And when I first heard of a two meal plan I had a great
06:52 deal of anxiety about this, I knew that I would be suffering
06:56 a great deal of hunger, and that this would be quite
07:00 distressful for me, and so I was geared up to really be
07:03 miserable, but I was determined I was going to give it a try.
07:08 - And the giving up the TV may have been the biggest part
07:11 of the problem.
07:12 Mine might have been more distressing than giving up
07:15 the food, did you find it so?
07:17 - Actually I was so pleasantly surprised to find that this
07:21 was not as painful as I thought it would be.
07:24 - You didn't go around hungry all the time?
07:27 - About the first three days of giving up supper
07:31 I really was missing it, and I felt a sense of
07:37 what should I be doing with myself.
07:39 I had a little bit of disorientation in how to
07:42 spend my time, and that really helped me focus on the fact
07:45 that my stomach was empty.
07:46 - So it only took about three days to become a little bit
07:49 accustomed to it.
07:50 - Surprisingly!
07:51 - Oh Rhonda, it took me much much longer than that
07:56 I remember making a New Year's Resolution,
07:58 I had been cutting down on my suppers for a long time
08:02 but I made a New Year's Resolution,
08:06 I'm not going to eat suppers any more.
08:07 We had gotten to the place where we only had peaches
08:12 in the evening, or some kind of fruit, and then
08:17 New Year's Day came and I said New Year's Resolution!
08:21 I will not eat suppers any more, I know that it's physiologic,
08:26 I know that it's going to be beneficial,
08:28 I know that it will help me to loose a few pounds of weight
08:30 and by that time I was only about 10 or 15 Lbs. overweight.
08:35 Through the years I had lost a little weight, of the fat
08:41 that I had gained extra when I was a teenager
08:43 and so I was not to overweight by that time,
08:48 but I was happy to anticipate those 10 or 15 Lbs.
08:53 But to the thought of giving up my third square meal
08:58 was not very pleasant, so I sailed into it though
09:03 and I determined that I would not eat suppers.
09:07 I prayed that the Lord would help me to control my appetite
09:10 and I was so determined that I would not even look at the
09:14 refrigerator, I would try not to even think about the kitchen
09:17 nor think about food, nor planning menus,
09:19 nor anything of that nature until after I had eaten
09:24 again the next day
09:25 So three months went by it was the first of April,
09:29 and it was along about the first of April when I began
09:32 to be comfortable not eating that third meal.
09:35 - Really! Wow!
09:37 - What do you find now, are you happy with the third meal?
09:41 Do you ever just have a craving for supper?
09:43 - Yes, of course I've had some times it was difficult,
09:46 but I've learned some good tips, and I wanted to share
09:49 those you and with those who are watching today that
09:52 maybe these will be of help to them as well.
09:54 One of the things that I had to get over was the fear
09:58 of being hungry or being distressed about loosing this
10:01 third meal, and it took a lot of really good positive talk
10:05 knowing that I was making this change for good and important
10:07 reasons and really committing myself to making the
10:10 change fully.
10:11 Also I planned to keep myself busy during the evening hours
10:16 I did not follow the same routine that had been so
10:19 connected with overeating and my snacking habits,
10:22 I did completely different things, in fact I even stayed
10:25 out of my house during that time and kept busy,
10:29 I started practicing the piano which I hadn't played for
10:31 many years so that was fun to kind of renew that hobby,
10:34 or I would go for a walk, those are things I recommend
10:37 to fill that time another way.
10:38 Also it's important to make sure the breakfast and lunch
10:42 that you have are very nutritious full of things
10:45 that will give fiber fruits, and vegetables, raw foods are
10:49 important to include in each meal, having whole grains,
10:52 legumes and even a few nuts, but making sure they will hold you.
10:57 Not overeating, that will actually make you hungrier
11:01 in the evening than if you have appropriate portion size
11:04 very nutrition meal.
11:06 Another thing that I found helpful was to have a friend
11:08 do this with me, when I wasn't in this alone and I had a
11:12 partner to go and do things with during supper time
11:14 or someone to pray with me or to encourage me along the way.
11:19 These are some tips that I have found helpful in
11:23 implementing a two meal plan.
11:24 For people who have children Dr. Thrash who have to
11:30 have a third meal for their children, what suggestions
11:32 might you have for someone who's trying to do a two meal plan?
11:35 Well we sometimes think that two meals might be alright
11:40 for adults but certainly children could not survive on
11:44 two meals, but the answer is yes they can in fact it's the
11:47 most healthful plan for children as well.
11:50 This I learned when I was in Physiology classes in
11:53 Medical School, now for the child who is in a home
12:00 where the adults do not take a third meal, the most logical
12:05 is for them also not to take a third meal.
12:09 You will find that your children if you are practicing
12:13 two meals a day, a two meal plan, your children will have
12:18 to be interrupted from what they are doing and brought in
12:22 and told it is now time for you to eat supper,
12:26 or they won't remember it at all, you don't have food
12:30 on the table, you are not cooking in the kitchen,
12:33 you don't have anything that they are accustomed to getting
12:36 at a certain time, you don't have any of those things around
12:40 then they will find that the most logical thing to do what
12:43 you do, you continue your activities until it's time
12:47 for you to prepare for that routine that you go through
12:51 before you go to bed, worship, maybe a story time,
12:54 and then to bed for the children.
12:57 They will consider that the most logical, and rational,
13:00 and normal thing to do, and I have seen it happen many times
13:04 in families where the children are from 1- 3 years of age
13:11 they can easily be trained to a two meal plan.
13:14 If they are older, let's say they are about 10 or 12,
13:17 you may have more difficulty with them, because they remember
13:22 that they are supposed to eat at this time of the day
13:25 that being in the evening, but it's better for them
13:29 if they don't eat the third meal because one the big things
13:33 we are seeing now days is obesity in children and a child
13:39 who goes through puberty being over weight
13:43 it's very likely that they will be overweight
13:45 the rest of their lives, or they will at least be fighting
13:49 the battle of appetite all of their lives.
13:52 So I tell parents who are the parents of small children
13:56 do not allow your child to go through puberty
14:00 being overweight, conquer this habit, the habit of eating
14:03 to much, of eating to frequently, of eating foods
14:07 that are to rich, conquer these habits before they go through
14:10 puberty or they will forever have a hard time.
14:14 Yes, a two meal plan is for children as well.
14:19 - That's so helpful to know.
14:20 - Now tell me, I have found two things for my patients
14:27 that have been really serious problems,
14:29 one is how do you handle the church pot luck,
14:33 and secondly how do you handle the big sit down function
14:39 that occurs in the evening, say someone is getting married,
14:43 and there is a real premium on this marriage, for "You,"
14:47 it's a close relative, or in some other way,
14:52 you really are a part of the spotlight, what can you do
14:57 in those two instances?
14:58 The church pot luck or the the family reunion
15:02 or the big sit down evening meal,
15:07 do you have any tips on that?
15:08 - I have a few, one tip that I really like to give for people
15:12 who are going to pot luck is take your own food,
15:15 take your own dishes, you can even take your own lunch
15:18 and you can still enjoy all of the fellowship and social
15:21 activity around you without being tempted by all the lovely
15:24 things that are over on the other table.
15:26 Bring dishes that you know your family can enjoy,
15:29 that you enjoy, sometimes it's helpful to save one of your
15:33 favorite healthful dishes to take to an occasion so that
15:36 you don't feel deprived, you get your special dish
15:38 to take with you.
15:39 Another is to go towards the end of the pot luck line,
15:44 and if you go towards the end you will know many of the
15:46 selections will already be gone, so you will have fewer things
15:49 to choose from.
15:50 Now this puts you at risk of being left with choices
15:53 that may not be as healthful for you and so just keep that
15:57 in mind as you consider...
15:58 Always pray before pot luck and remember that you have
16:01 and angel right beside you who is there to help
16:03 and strengthen you.
16:04 Sometimes I would go at the end of church service,
16:07 and drink two large glasses of cool water, walk around
16:11 a little bit, head back over towards the pot luck,
16:13 towards the end of the line and by then enough time
16:16 would have passed that the water would have helped suppress
16:19 my appetite and I was able to be a little more temperate
16:22 in my choices.
16:23 It becomes more difficult when we get involved in social
16:27 occasions, so much of our society involves evening events
16:30 and evening activities.
16:31 A friend of mine says what she does is tells her friends
16:34 and family, you know I'm sorry I won't be able to eat
16:37 any of that because of my doctors orders,
16:41 and your doctor... - Doctors orders,
16:42 that's a good one.
16:43 - The great physician has ordered me to refrain
16:47 from that third meal.
16:49 Again maybe you can take your own vegetable tray or something
16:52 that if you feel that you have to imbibe can be something
16:56 very simple an very light that would be something easily
17:00 digested, I think though it's best just to be honest with
17:03 people and let them know I won't be able to have any food
17:07 with you that evening, but I would love to sit
17:09 and enjoy your company.
17:10 Those are tough if you are very tempted by the
17:13 things before you.
17:14 - Yes and sometimes something that you can do is drink
17:18 a cup of tea at the time that they are taking the meal
17:22 and you explain this ahead of time, doctors orders
17:25 that I won't be taking the third meal, and then
17:29 they may ask well what can I provide for you,
17:32 will you take some juice or will you take some soup,
17:35 and the answer is of course no I will not need that either.
17:40 And then you can say but if you have some herb tea, I will be
17:46 happy to have something like mint tea or catnip tea,
17:50 that's another good one catnip also quails the appetite a bit
17:53 and that can be very helpful.
17:56 - I would like to mention to our viewers a couple of other teas
17:59 that have been helpful to me personally on occasions when
18:02 I have been feeling hungry and known that I shouldn't eat.
18:04 There are two teas that have been helpful and I make them
18:08 together: One is chickweed, the other is fennel,
18:12 and fennel has a really nice licorice taste,
18:14 those two teas put together have quelled my appetite
18:18 on occasions when I didn't want to eat, and something about that
18:21 warm tea is very soothing, so again helping you
18:23 not feel deprived.
18:25 So I guess that's some of the tips that I have for that
18:28 Dr. Thrash.
18:29 - I have another tip and that is when you are going
18:33 to someone's house and you are going to be there for a
18:36 few days, it is well to let the hostess know ahead of time
18:40 what your dietary restrictions will be, if they lay in some
18:45 beautiful steaks for you and a lot of cheese and other things
18:51 that you don't eat any way, and certainly don't eat on a
18:55 weight control program.
18:56 It may be that you have a serious problem with the hostess
19:01 she may feel quite unkind towards you for letting her
19:06 lay in all of these things that you are not going to eat anyway.
19:10 Now I've asked Dr. Don Miller if he will also give some
19:16 thoughts that he has about how to approach this problem
19:20 it is certainly not a small problem, it's a very serious
19:23 thing and Dr. Miller welcome to the program and I'm happy
19:28 that you are going to bring us some tips also,
19:31 what do you have to say to us?
19:33 Well an interesting point, you've talked a lot about
19:35 eating suppers, but almost as important if not eating
19:39 suppers, is eating breakfast.
19:40 - Good point!
19:41 - And many people, they don't eat breakfast,
19:43 and if you don't eat breakfast that means that your glucose
19:47 is going to start getting low and you start getting that
19:49 feeling in mid morning and you then you have to sort of
19:51 grab some of this and grab some of that,
19:53 and that's going to be very bad for your body
19:55 because it's almost always going to be refined
19:57 carbohydrates, it's going to be a soda, it's going to be chips,
20:00 it's going to be candy, which is going to raise your
20:04 When your triglycerides go up, now this is a new study coming
20:07 out of Rockefeller University in New York City,
20:12 that when our triglycerides rise in the body from eating
20:15 high fat diets, it can effect the brain,
20:18 it goes into the hypothalamus, the hypothalamus produces
20:22 some neuro peptides which then suppress the...
20:26 well not suppress the appetite, it suppresses your ability
20:30 to feel like you are full and it makes you more hungry,
20:34 and so the more fat you eat, besides the fact that it's
20:36 going to perhaps make you more fat this way, it makes you
20:39 hungrier, so the best thing to do is to lower the fat intake.
20:43 But going back to the breakfast it is the most important meal
20:46 of the day, we find that people that don't eat breakfast
20:49 have more heart attacks in the morning when most
20:52 heart attacks occur.
20:53 So eating that good breakfast, now people sit and say
20:56 I can't eat breakfast, I get sick, I don't feel like eating
21:00 that's fine don't eat breakfast, don't eat lunch,
21:04 and don't eat supper, the next morning go back to the
21:08 breakfast table, if you still can't eat breakfast,
21:10 don't eat it, and don't eat lunch, and don't eat supper,
21:15 and the third morning when you go to the breakfast table,
21:18 you must be hard core if you can't eat breakfast yet.
21:21 But if you can't eat breakfast yet don't eat it, and don't eat
21:25 lunch, and don't eat supper, you do until finally
21:28 you sit there and say I will eat anything including the
21:32 tablecloth, but now the key is make sure what's on the table
21:36 is good food,
21:37 Remove temptation from the plate here, get things that
21:42 you should not eat... We had a patient come to
21:44 Uchee Pines some years ago, now he had prostate cancer,
21:48 and we don't just change their lifestyle, while they are with
21:52 us we give them a new lifestyle and a new rest of their lives.
21:55 I remember one day I heard him on the phone, he called home
21:58 he had an older child watching his house while he was gone,
22:01 he say's oh, by the way, everything in the refrigerator
22:03 everything in the freezer, everything in the cupboards
22:07 you can have because we can't eat it any more.
22:10 And he really cleaned out the place so when you start looking
22:14 for those things you should not have,
22:15 there not there anymore, and then if you stock your home
22:18 with good foods, low fat foods, complex carbohydrate foods like
22:23 some fruits and vegetable, whole grains, nuts and seeds
22:26 in moderation those last two, you are going to find that your
22:29 satiety factor is much more satisfied, you feel like umm,
22:32 I've had a good meal, I feel good about this.
22:35 Then I recommend when people want to loose weight
22:38 is after they eat the meal, they leave the scene
22:40 of the crime, my thought here is you get done with the meal
22:44 and you leave the table.
22:45 So often you get done eating and you are sitting there
22:49 and you look back down at the table and
22:52 well that looks pretty good and... you're just talking
22:56 around the table and you are looking and there's one over
22:58 here, and you just keep on eating and you never seem
23:03 to stop.
23:04 - Dr. Miller, in our society it isn't appropriate
23:08 to leave the table while there are still people eating.
23:11 How do you handle that?
23:13 - Well, that's a good question, you know I travel a lot overseas
23:17 and depending on where you go, I love Ukraine, they are my
23:20 second family over there and they look at me and I'm...
23:24 they might use the word gaunt, I use the word I'm a runners
23:28 physique, but they look at me and they think have to
23:30 fatten me up, and so the way that they fatten you up
23:34 is add more fat to the food, well that's what their food is,
23:36 high fat food, and why do we add fat to food?
23:40 Because it makes it taste better, and so they are putting
23:42 all this fat in my food... and I was there not long ago,
23:47 and I had taken two suits with me, one suit is still
23:51 over there because I can't get into that thing any more
23:53 at all, the second suit...
23:55 - They did fatten you up I see.
23:56 - Did they ever, and one suit I had on, I bent down and
23:59 put a big air hole in the back of that one,
24:01 and it had to be sewn back up, but I found that when I went
24:05 back down to another country like Moldova I got right back
24:08 down to my size.
24:09 - They understood about not giving a lot of fats
24:12 with the food.
24:13 - There was not fat in this food, or very little,
24:15 as soon as I get back up to Ukraine, they say Ahh!
24:17 what happened, and they start giving you the food.
24:22 I love them for it, and I love, the food, but it's a challenge.
24:25 - They are very hospitable.
24:26 - When there is still food on the table, or they are still
24:29 around the table and you are still there, now is time for
24:34 some will power, I don't know any other...
24:35 do you have a suggestion? - Let me ask you,
24:37 what if Aunt Jane comes to you and says "Donald son,"
24:44 I have made this "just for you," how do you handle that?
24:50 You know it's something you should not eat.
24:52 - Well, I don't know if you are going to like my answer because
24:55 I've been in this situation.
24:57 When I first became a vegan, I was getting ready to go home
25:02 to Cincinnati and my wonderful sister was there and she knew
25:05 I had become a vegetarian so she made a special dish
25:09 just for me, Manicotti!
25:11 - What is that?
25:13 - It's pasta filled with cheese.
25:15 - Oh yes!
25:16 - And I didn't know what to do, you go home and...
25:19 and to me as long as it does not violate my moral code
25:25 unclean meats, I think cheese is almost in that category
25:29 but the point I was at I ate some, I didn't pig out on it,
25:33 but I ate some, she had made that just for me.
25:37 If Aunt Jane or Aunt Sue, whatever her name is,
25:39 makes me a dish, correct me if I am wrong,
25:43 and I say alright there's no pork in there, there's no
25:46 rattlesnake, there's no camel, maybe a little bit of milk,
25:49 although nowadays we are living in a strange world, prions and
25:52 e- coli, and everything else...
25:55 - It's a hard thing, I understand.
25:59 - The key is making sure that they know before you even
26:01 go there, I'm sorry, I am a complete vegan.
26:05 I was once eating at my sister's home, and my brother-in-law
26:09 brought home pizza's for supper, well I can't eat the pizza.
26:12 - Covered with cheese, covered with pepperoni's.
26:13 - Of course, and I says well I'm sorry, I really can't eat
26:16 that but I will eat your crusts, and as they would finish
26:19 their pizza, I would gather their crusts,
26:22 and my brother-in-law told my sister afterwards,
26:24 he said I was so humiliated by what he did.
26:27 So now when I am at their house, they will bring home
26:29 a pizza with no cheese on it.
26:31 - No cheese on it, that sounds good.
26:32 Well I have found that often that does happen,
26:35 but it's a hard thing to deal with that kind of problem.
26:39 I know that one of the most successful things as a physician
26:45 that I have done is to help a woman loose weight when she
26:50 was 100 Lbs. over weight, had a large diabetic ulcer,
26:54 had already lost the feeling in both legs, she felt that she
27:00 was not going to survive another month, and during the time that
27:05 she was at Uchee Pines, she did loose about 65 or 70 Lbs.
27:10 She was with us about 6 or 7 months as I recall,
27:14 had an enormous weight loss, very successful,
27:18 the leg ulcer healed up, she got so that she could walk
27:22 without a walker or a cane.
27:24 It was just a really great success story.
27:27 So I hope that the things that we have talked with you about
27:31 concerning how to control the weight will be an eternal
27:35 blessing to you.
27:36 That you will not only benefit in this life,
27:39 but that in the life to come you can praise the Lord for
27:43 the victories that you have won in controlling the appetite
27:47 and what happens in one area, can also give you strength
27:50 and moral courage in another area.
27:53 May God Bless you!