Participants: Paul & Carolyn Rayne (Host), Hannah & Caleb Rayne
Series Code: HTH
Program Code: HTH00012A
00:01 You know, it's easy these days
00:03 for children to live a secret life,
00:05 a secret life from their parents that is.
00:07 So, we need to tune in to our children's world
00:10 and not be afraid to ask some
00:13 of those awkward questions.
00:15 Join us today on Happy the Home,
00:17 as we look at a secret life.
00:40 Okay, Carolyn, it's over to you for story time tonight.
00:44 Okay, now tonight's story that I have picked
00:47 is called "Telling Mother."
00:49 It sounds like a good one huh?
00:52 A group of young girls stood about the door of
00:54 the schoolroom one afternoon,
00:56 whispering together. When a little girl
00:58 joined them, and asked what they were doing.
01:01 "I am telling the girls a secret, said Kate,
01:04 and we will let you know if you promise not to
01:06 tell any one as long as you live."
01:10 "I won't tell any one but my mother,"
01:12 replied Kate. "I tell her everything,
01:14 for she is my best friend." "No, not even your mother,
01:19 no one in the whole world."
01:21 "Well, then said Kate, I can't hear it;
01:23 for what I can't tell mother,
01:25 is not fit for me to know."
01:27 After speaking these words, Kate walked slowly
01:30 and perhaps sadly, yet with a quite conscience,
01:34 while her companions went home with
01:36 their secret conversation.
01:38 I am sure that if Kate continued
01:40 to act on that principle, she became a virtuous,
01:43 useful young woman. No child or a Christian
01:47 mother will be likely to take a sinful course,
01:50 if Kate's reply is taken for a rule of conduct.
01:55 As soon as a boy listens to conversations at school
01:58 or in the playground, which he would fear
02:00 or blush to repeat to his mother,
02:02 he is in the way of temptation,
02:04 and no one can tell where he will stop.
02:06 Many a man dying in disgrace, in prison,
02:09 or on the scaffold, has looked back with bitte
02:12 remorse to the time when he first listened
02:14 to a sinful companion who came between him
02:17 and a pious mother. Girls, if you would be
02:21 respected and honored in this life
02:23 and form characters for heaven,
02:25 make Kate's reply your rule:
02:28 "What I cannot tell my mother
02:30 is unfit for me to know."
02:32 No other person can have as great an interest
02:35 in your welfare and prosperity as a true,
02:38 Christian mother. Every girl should always
02:41 remember that a Christian mother
02:43 is her best earthly friend, from whom no secret
02:46 should be kept, and every boy too right.
02:51 So, children what do you make to that story?
02:55 To be careful that we don't have secrets.
02:58 Yeah, what do you think Caleb?
03:00 We need to be like the lady and not have anything
03:02 that we wouldn't want our parents to hear.
03:04 Alright, so here's the obvious question that
03:07 the parents are gonna ask you at this point is,
03:10 so have you ever had any secrets from the parents?
03:16 I used to sometimes tell things to Hannah,
03:20 I wouldn't tell them to you, but nothing bad.
03:23 Alright, well that's is the very point that
03:26 we're getting at. Why, I mean if he's just,
03:29 you know you're telling her that you know
03:31 you're going outside or something,
03:33 then that's no big deal, but what kind of things
03:36 you're talking about? Well, I think I had a,
03:40 so and so one time, I told Hannah, I said that,
03:43 I say thank you but I can't think of.
03:45 That's fine, before we got going,
03:49 we were talking a little bit about when you two
03:52 were quite a bit younger in school,
03:53 what was going on there, do you remember?
03:55 Tell us Hannah. Yeah, Hannah you tell us.
03:58 Well, we would go into, there will be some
04:01 argument going and pencils would end up going
04:04 flying around the school. And then what was your,
04:08 what were you doing to Hannah amongst
04:09 the pencils flying around. I throw my hand.
04:12 Yeah, and then you told us just before,
04:15 just a few moments ago something else as well.
04:17 I would poke her and stuff like that.
04:19 Yeah, what with the pencil or with your hand or what?
04:21 I don't know. I think both.
04:23 Both probably, but I don't remember.
04:24 So, where was I all this point,
04:26 I go to the bathroom or something.
04:28 Can't remember. I just wasn't there.
04:30 It was a longtime ago, it was 8 years ago,
04:32 wasn't it? We were at least. Six months ago.
04:34 No, well 8 years ago, we were very young
04:37 I know that much, because I don't remember.
04:39 So, you were always sure to make sure
04:41 I was around at the time? I guess.
04:43 You know, children we have raised you
04:45 as you're growing up not to have secrets
04:47 from your parents, and viewers,
04:49 we're gonna talk a little bit about that,
04:51 once the children and they're gonna go
04:54 and get ready for bed here shortly and we're gonna
04:55 spend sometime with you. Just Carolyn and I,
04:58 but children, have you ever had any other
05:01 kind of big secrets from your parents?
05:04 Well, secrets that are good we like birthday presents
05:07 or Christmas presents that we're keeping a
05:08 secret from you, instead of going and telling,
05:10 guess what we're gonna get you for Christmas.
05:12 Yeah, actually Caleb is so good at not
05:15 keeping secrets, we have to keep secrets from him,
05:17 because he'll tell them, he will tell us what his
05:19 birthday presents or somebody's birthday
05:21 present is or whatever. You know, I just wanted
05:23 to throw in here, at church just last week,
05:26 somebody who was gonna be preaching
05:28 at our local church wanted Caleb to keep a
05:32 secret about a part in the sermon,
05:34 he wanted Caleb to play. Now this part in the
05:36 sermon is gonna be in a couple of weeks time,
05:38 remember. And, so he asked Caleb,
05:40 he said, would you, could you keep a secret?
05:43 And Caleb said, well as long as I can tell my parents.
05:47 Now, this gentlemen came to me,
05:49 I didn't know about this, it was the potluck week,
05:51 and so he came to me in potluck and he said,
05:54 I really appreciate the way you've
05:55 raised your children. Because Caleb wasn't
05:57 gonna keep a secret, even about the sermon,
06:00 I'm gonna be doing in two weeks time as long as
06:02 he could tell his parents. You know, we need to be,
06:05 we wanna encourage you, it's important to give
06:08 our children the freedom to be able to come to us
06:10 and tell us things that we don't know about.
06:12 Well, more then giving them the freedom,
06:14 training them to confide in us.
06:18 And we're gonna talk about that children,
06:20 why don't you go and get ready for bed
06:23 and then mommy and daddy will spend a bit of time
06:26 and then we'll have worship here later on? Alright.
06:31 You know, something that we.
06:32 I'll come and join you over there. Sure. My dear.
06:38 Something that story really picks up on is whispering.
06:42 Tell us a little bit about whispering then?
06:43 Well, little girls when they get together
06:47 and they whisper, whisper, whisper
06:49 and they're maybe three or four years old,
06:50 it kind of looks cute doesn't it?
06:51 We've all seen that happen, and I don't know what
06:54 went through your mind, but through my mind is,
06:56 wait till they're order, I wonder what they'll be
06:57 like then. You know, when girls are
07:00 7, 8, 9, 10 and they're whispering
07:02 and then into their teen years.
07:04 They're wanting to have conversations
07:06 that you aren't meant to be a part of.
07:07 And you can walk in the room and all of a sudden
07:09 it goes deadly quiet. And they look up,
07:11 up at you like what you wanna know.
07:14 That's a red flag right there for me.
07:17 But, what seemed to me that and probably
07:20 to some of our viewers that whispering is,
07:23 it's pretty innocent, but you're saying then is,
07:26 once the girls or even boys get
07:28 into the habit of whispering, it's really,
07:30 it's the start of a secret life,
07:34 is that what you're saying, where they,
07:35 they're trying to exclude us?
07:38 Well, it doesn't start out that way,
07:40 but in whispering your children, our children
07:43 end up finding out things that we may not have
07:46 yet have told them. There are certain things
07:49 obviously we're being careful,
07:50 because this is a family program
07:51 but there are certain things that as your
07:53 privilege as a parent to be educating your children on.
07:57 And I was educated by other children and many,
08:00 many of us were, but it doesn't need
08:02 to be that way, it shouldn't be that way.
08:04 But for the most part, a lot of children find out
08:07 things they shouldn't know about life by other
08:09 children through those kind of means.
08:11 Well, okay, I realize so far in the program
08:13 we haven't introduced ourselves,
08:16 that was Hannah and Caleb,
08:17 they were on the set with us,
08:18 and we are Paul and Carolyn and we glad
08:20 to have you with us for Happy the Home program
08:22 number 12, which is, A Secret Life.
08:26 And that's what we're discussing right now.
08:28 Carolyn, this idea of a secret life starts off
08:33 maybe with the children whispering
08:35 when they're little. And then they start
08:38 talking about, particularly girls maybe
08:40 start talking about girly stuff and they're trying to,
08:43 they're trying to keep that a secret from their parents.
08:48 Where would that, what would make that
08:51 difficult later on, maybe in their teen years?
08:54 Because if a child has become familiar with
08:58 having information that he's keeping
09:00 from the parents, even though it started out
09:02 as innocent stuff, then it tends to feed into,
09:05 making choices to have information withheld
09:09 from their parents and then we find that parents
09:12 find out stuff many years later and they're horrified
09:16 to find out this secret life that was going on,
09:18 but it began with what seemed apparently innocent,
09:21 earlier years. So, that's the point
09:23 that I'm picking up from what you're saying,
09:25 2 and 3 year old, 2 and 3 year old girls kind of,
09:28 4 year olds whispering is one thing,
09:31 because it's innocent,
09:32 but it doesn't stay innocent.
09:34 It's almost like the enemy of the souls uses
09:37 that later on to pull them away from us
09:40 and then they end up in a secret life.
09:44 And let me talk a little bit about the secret life,
09:46 because we tend to think of that something,
09:48 oh! No, a secret life but it can be quite mild
09:51 at first and then get bigger.
09:53 You know, it's quite likely that your children,
09:58 if you're watching this program
10:00 and you have children, even of varying ages,
10:02 that they have secrets from you,
10:05 what do we do about that? Some of them might be
10:07 innocent secrets like Caleb there, bless his heart.
10:12 You know that, you know he told Hannah he had
10:14 a sour throat once, so that's fine.
10:17 Well the reason for that is because of the sensitivity
10:20 that I particularly had as a child realizing
10:23 the dangerous I fell into, we would determine
10:26 that our children wouldn't grow up with that.
10:28 And so that is why to them any kind of whispering
10:31 they intently feel like this isn't a good thing,
10:33 unless you're walking into a room
10:35 and they need to ask us something privately,
10:37 and they don't want to speak it out loud
10:38 in front of the whole room. So, tell the viewers,
10:42 some of your experience of when you were growing up
10:46 and how you have that kind of separation
10:50 for a little while? Well, as a young person
10:54 growing up, I was raised in a Christian family
10:57 and so when you are raised as a Christian young person
11:01 you have a certain understanding
11:03 of right and wrong. And I knew very well
11:05 that the right principles of living and yet,
11:07 and it wasn't really in my teen years even,
11:10 this was in my early 20's that I made certain
11:12 choices associative with certain people,
11:15 that led me in the direction that I would not ever
11:18 wanna dream of my children going in.
11:20 And there was awhile, for awhile when everything
11:24 on the outside was the same, I was still in church,
11:27 I was doing all the same things,
11:29 going all the same places. But I knew deep
11:31 in my heart that I was making choices through
11:34 my associations that were not living up to
11:36 those principles. And I was crying out inside
11:40 because I wanted to break from that.
11:42 But I was kind of locked into it and couldn't
11:44 get out of it. And I can remember going home,
11:46 I was living away from home at this point.
11:48 And I remember going home and seeing
11:49 my father and I, within me was wanting him
11:52 to ask me Carolyn, what's going on?
11:55 But I sensed, I sensed that he didn't ask
11:59 because he didn't wanna know,
12:01 not because he didn't love me,
12:03 but because he was fearful about
12:04 what I might tell him. But that's, I mean that
12:07 could be happening to some of our viewers
12:09 right now that they've got children,
12:12 who have got a heavy burden on their heart.
12:15 They've got a secret and they wanna tell
12:20 mom and dad but, you know what it's like,
12:22 so we know what it's like when you got...
12:25 Maybe in a marriage relationship,
12:26 if the other person will bring the subject up,
12:29 I'll run with it but you know
12:32 who is the stronger person, who is the one with
12:35 maturity in our relationship with our children,
12:37 obviously it's us, as parents.
12:39 So, what we wanna spend some time on this program
12:43 is investigating and seeing where our children are,
12:48 you know in program number two.
12:51 If you could remember back, program number two
12:55 corresponded with chapter number two
12:58 in the Connected Family book,
12:59 you wanna grab that for me Sweetheart.
13:03 If you haven't got yourself a copy of
13:05 The Connected Family, it's the companion book
13:08 that goes with this program, Happy the Home.
13:11 Carolyn and I wrote that, so that you could
13:13 not only have these TV programs or DVD's
13:17 however you're watching it to go with.
13:19 But you could have something written
13:20 that you could follow along with as well so.
13:23 We encourage you to get a copy of that,
13:25 that you can get it from the number
13:27 in the corner of the screen now.
13:28 I think they run an ad later on, but the point is
13:31 as we as our children grow up naturally
13:36 they pickup some of these secrets
13:38 and it's gotta be on our hearts
13:40 as parents to check in. We've got to investigate;
13:45 we've gotta open up the subject.
13:47 Now, we can't force the children to open up,
13:50 but we wanna talk specifically about
13:52 how to open that aspect up, how to open up
13:56 the secret life that our children,
13:58 the burden they might be carrying?
14:00 So, how do we go about doing that?
14:02 Now, that's the obvious question,
14:05 a challenge you know the end of each program
14:07 we have a challenge and the challenge
14:09 for this program is. For you to investigate
14:11 the secret life of your children,
14:13 so you really might wanna listen up
14:14 at this point that. You know, we are not
14:17 necessarily the experts on this,
14:18 but we have done it quite a bit with our parents.
14:21 Then what holds us back as parents is that
14:26 we think that maybe somebody else would be
14:28 better at this. Maybe this is the pastor's job
14:31 or the youth leader's job, I mean who am I
14:33 to go prying around, but you're the mom and dad.
14:36 And it's definitely your responsibility.
14:39 So, how would we go about it?
14:41 What we have done with our children?
14:42 Is, it's not obviously something you can,
14:46 like when we had our family right here
14:47 and we're having story time.
14:49 And I know I was asking the children,
14:51 have you got any secrets, but if I really suspected
14:54 something, I would look for some one on one time
14:58 and we cover that in program number 7
15:01 I think it was. And we're gonna
15:02 cover it a bit more in another program,
15:04 but I wouldn't look for some one on one time
15:06 with my child and I would just say something like so,
15:10 lets pick Hannah. Hannah, well, first of all,
15:15 I start off maybe with some small conversation,
15:17 hey Hannah, how's things going in your school
15:19 and hey, what are you up to with you know
15:23 in your break time there? And then I would try
15:27 and lead the conversation on so you know,
15:30 how's your conscious Hannah?
15:33 And then the hardest thing to do at that point,
15:37 that I find in myself being a little bit nervous
15:40 as a parent in a point like that.
15:42 And maybe you can enter in.
15:43 If you think about yourself asking your children
15:45 these questions so, Hannah, how's your conscious?
15:48 The point, the trick of that point is to stay quiet.
15:54 So how's your conscious Hannah?
15:59 See the silence invites them to pick it up,
16:03 now I've done this with Hannah
16:05 and I've done it sometimes for a specific reason,
16:08 maybe she's been. I've noted she's just
16:11 being grumpy or she's not grumpy or mardy but,
16:16 just kind of irritable. And I know she doesn't
16:19 feel good when she's like that.
16:20 So, what I'm doing is I'm giving her opportunity
16:23 to open up. And it's amazing
16:28 that the Holy Spirit or whatever it is I believe
16:31 it's the Holy Spirit can communicate to a child's
16:34 mind in an instant, and they hear it.
16:37 And so I've done this with Hannah,
16:39 anything on your conscious, and then the silence.
16:41 I'm sorry daddy, I'm, I don't know what was
16:45 wrong with me today, I just kind of grumpy
16:48 and Caleb was bugging me and...
16:53 Well, she's got it out, praise the Lord.
16:55 Now that's just a mild example,
16:57 but you know maybe you've got an older
17:00 teenage girl or I, we're picking on the girls.
17:03 But I suppose, well maybe no boys,
17:05 I've secrets as well. But, at least our boy
17:07 is much more open, but girls tend,
17:10 now I won't go there. What if you got an older
17:14 teenage girl and you say so anything on
17:17 your conscious? And she's thinking, yeah,
17:20 there is something on my conscious.
17:21 There's this boy and him and I are spending a
17:23 lot of time together and I suppose I should
17:25 tell mom and dad. What a great time,
17:28 mom and dad, for us to check in,
17:30 not leaving it until she comes home with some
17:35 devastating news. And that's happened
17:38 to us some parents, it's probably happened
17:40 to people you know, it's much better
17:43 that as parents we can be checking in
17:46 with our children, investigating
17:49 their secret life. If you had to do that with
17:51 either Hannah or Caleb, can you remember?
17:55 Well, I was actually thinking about something
17:56 quite different. Okay, that's fine, that's fine,
17:59 and we're being very spontaneously.
18:01 We are, we are and you know we are talking
18:03 about an older child, but you need to be checking
18:08 into the heart of your younger children
18:10 and as we were talking, I'm just being
18:12 very vulnerable, it took me back
18:14 to my own childhood. And I was, I must have
18:18 been around about 9 and my parents didn't know
18:22 about this, but there was a girl in the school
18:24 I went to, who lived not so far away from I did,
18:27 who was quite a bully. And she begin to....
18:31 I would get kind of they would wait,
18:32 her and her friends would wait around the corner
18:34 and they would jump out on me,
18:35 as I was returning from school
18:36 and kind of beat on me. And you know still,
18:38 it wasn't very pleasant and the way I go out of
18:41 them doing that was buying them candy.
18:44 And I'm just being really vulnerable here,
18:47 I got the candy from my parents,
18:50 because I stole it from them.
18:52 I knew where they kept money in a drawer
18:53 and I would take the money and I would go buy
18:55 the candy and I don't know how long this went on for.
18:59 But eventually my father figured
19:01 that there was little bits of money missing,
19:03 but I did go and steal hundreds of dollars.
19:06 It was just you know 50 cents here
19:08 and a dollar there. And it went on for quite
19:10 awhile and it was done out of fear on my part
19:13 about this girl and if I didn't,
19:15 she was gonna get, her father who was gonna
19:17 beat up my father. And this whole kind of
19:19 scenario was going on. And I was about
19:21 9 years old, and eventually my parents find out,
19:23 they were devastated that I had been dishonest
19:27 and I had stolen and lied, they were devastated.
19:30 They didn't, they didn't yell at me,
19:34 I don't remember getting a spanking for it,
19:35 I remember the most heart breaking thing was
19:37 to realize the hurt that I cause them.
19:40 But I remember being that vulnerable to share that,
19:42 I think I ever shared it with you,
19:44 my children have never heard about that before.
19:46 But I'm sharing that because we may think,
19:51 well, when they get into their mid and late teens,
19:53 we better start checking in our children,
19:55 make sure there's nothing going on.
19:57 But that was back, hey I'm 47 years,
19:59 that's nearly 40 years ago, it was 38 years ago
20:02 that was going on and I was just a 9 year old.
20:05 So, we need to start checking in with
20:06 the hearts of our younger children,
20:08 is there anything that could be going on
20:11 in their little lives that we are totally oblivious to,
20:14 because that was the very case back then.
20:17 I appreciate you sharing, it's you know parents,
20:20 ignorance is not bliss, no. You know, if you've got a
20:27 leaky roof, ignoring the leaky roof doesn't fix it,
20:33 putting a bucket underneath the leak
20:36 so that it catches the drop that kind of fixes the mess.
20:40 But it doesn't fix the problem, so parents,
20:43 we really want to encourage you to and we mentioned,
20:47 oh! That was earlier on, I never went there,
20:50 my mind went a different way,
20:51 program number two. We had you investigating
20:56 your children's bedrooms if you remember
20:58 what in their world is going on.
20:59 And we promise you in program number two
21:02 that if you didn't dealing deal with it,
21:04 we would get to it. Now, we've had all this
21:07 time to develop a relationship,
21:09 we'd one on one time. We've been using
21:11 encouraging words, we've done some
21:13 fun things together, we'd family time.
21:16 Now, that ground has been prepared,
21:19 the relationship hopefully is better then
21:22 it was in program two. So, now we're looking at
21:25 opening up those things and if you found
21:28 you know cigarettes underneath the bed or
21:31 if you found text messages on the cell phone
21:33 or whatever you found, this is the place
21:36 to start bringing that up. But, don't go in there with,
21:40 now several weeks ago, your father
21:42 and I found this, and we just been waiting
21:44 for this opportunity to nail you on this one.
21:46 Don't do that please, you go to,
21:49 it's gonna take all the, every bit of the connection
21:52 you've got with God to stay calm,
21:54 to be nice and ask questions.
21:57 Don't jump in there with accusations,
21:59 ask questions and invite the children into a,
22:04 don't corner them. Well, when I say don't
22:09 corner them, I'm not also saying let them off,
22:11 ask some leading questions. So, you know is there,
22:14 is there anything you feel like you need to tell us.
22:17 And then wait, don't be nervous and fill in the gap.
22:21 And if they, kind of shook their shoulders and say,
22:24 well I don't know. Then don't leave it at that,
22:28 because children can be vague when they wanna try
22:33 and cover it up. So, you know I've had
22:35 that with our children, I said to Caleb,
22:36 so you know what's on your heart son?
22:39 I don't know. Well, think about it a little bit,
22:44 daddy would like to know. And don't jump in,
22:47 I can't stress that enough, it's like a negotiations.
22:50 He who speaks first loses. So not that we're trying
22:54 to negotiate with our children here,
22:55 but give them opportunity, they maybe not used to this,
22:58 maybe they're having to work up the courage.
23:00 And then talk a little bit about the joy of having a
23:04 clean conscience, that's really
23:07 what we're looking for. We're investigating
23:09 their conscience. And if the Lord's been working
23:12 on their heart, and hopefully has,
23:14 in answer to our prayers you know.
23:16 We've been encouraging you often and over again
23:19 to pray for your children.
23:20 This is kind of like a culmination point,
23:23 that the children hopefully
23:24 if they've got things on their heart,
23:26 they'll have the courage. Now, you don't have
23:28 to pick your time, maybe bedtime,
23:31 maybe in the vehicle when there is no eye contact.
23:35 Sometimes direct eye contact can be a little bit
23:37 intimidating here so. It really depends upon
23:41 the age and stage of your children doesn't it,
23:44 as to how you would and when you would deal with it?
23:48 Yeah, of course little children are
23:51 so much more open, then it's gonna be harder
23:55 with older children. But, go into this prayerfully,
23:59 we are just encouraging
24:01 you that ignorance is not bliss.
24:03 See problems generally, you know in your own life
24:06 problems don't just happen, they kind of grow.
24:10 And maybe you've done something wrong like
24:12 you with your friends you know jumping on you
24:15 and hitting you when you were coming
24:17 home from school. If your friends should said,
24:19 hey Carolyn, anything on your heart?
24:21 You know they were putting you to bed one night
24:23 and you know you might have just not been
24:25 out to keep it in. Yeah, there was girls
24:27 and gave it to me. It would have never
24:29 gone to the stealing stage and it could have been
24:33 nipped in the bud. And if we are not
24:37 checking in with our children,
24:38 these things tend to grow and then they get bigger
24:41 and bigger and bigger and they end up going public.
24:44 Right. And a lot of these things can happen
24:46 because of peer pressure. What's behind it
24:49 for our children is trying to fit in,
24:51 trying to be like their friends,
24:53 trying to come up to their expectations.
24:55 And so they do things that they are out of character
24:58 even for a child raised in a Christian home.
25:01 The point I wanna leave is with,
25:03 we're gonna go for a break here just in a short moment,
25:05 but please parents don't watch this program
25:10 and think yeah that's good but I know my children
25:14 haven't got any secrets. Because from a lot of
25:17 the parents that we have spoken with,
25:20 there is a lot more of a secret life going on,
25:22 in the eight and upwards today then we even realize.
25:29 And so, please don't push this aside
25:32 and say that's not relevant.
25:34 We encourage you to take an opportunity
25:37 to investigate the secret life
25:40 that your children may or may not be involved in.
25:43 It's part of what we call proactive parenting,
25:48 it's trying to get the things
25:50 before they're made into a big issue.
25:53 We're taking a break now;
25:54 join us in just a few moments.