Participants: Margot Marshall (Host), Dr. John Clark, Jenifer Skues
Series Code: HL
Program Code: HL000013A
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00:14 Welcome to "Healthy Living!"
00:16 I'm your host Margot Marshall. 00:19 We all know that high cholesterol is a risk factor 00:22 for heart disease but what effect does high cholesterol 00:25 have on mental performance? 00:27 The answer may surprise you! 01:04 On the program today we have Dr. John Clark and Jenifer Skues 01:09 a health psychologist. 01:11 Welcome to the program! Thank you. 01:12 We look forward to what you have 01:14 to say about this intriguing subject. 01:16 So high cholesterol just isn't a problem for our heart, 01:21 it's also affecting our mental performance. 01:23 Would you like to just fill us in on that a bit? 01:26 You know when we have high cholesterol, 01:28 our blood gets thicker. 01:30 When our blood gets thicker, 01:32 it's harder to pump around our body. 01:34 When it's thicker with cholesterol, 01:36 it has less of an oxygen-carrying capacity 01:40 and so your brain suffers for lower oxygen. 01:46 That's the pathway. 01:50 So we had an interesting gentleman that came to us 01:53 for help. 01:54 He was an anesthetist - somebody who works in a hospital 01:59 and puts people asleep for surgery. 02:01 He had just finished his schooling; he was way in debt 02:06 and he needed to pass his exam for certification 02:09 before he could start work. 02:10 He went and took the test for the first time and failed. 02:16 He was worried, he was stressed out. 02:19 He studied very hard for six weeks and took the test again. 02:24 Again he failed and that's when he thought, 02:28 "Well I better talk to Dr. Clark and see if there isn't 02:30 something I need to do to improve my mental performance." 02:34 Well, this was a difficult thing. 02:38 He's on the line - if he doesn't pass the test the next time, 02:41 he can't take the test for a long time, he can't work, 02:45 and yet his debts will be coming due - more stress. 02:49 Well, so I sat down with him and first I took a history on 02:53 what he was eating. 02:55 Some of the things that he was eating included foods 02:58 that would make his cholesterol go high. 03:00 I also looked at what he was doing in his lifestyle; 03:03 how much water he was drinking; how much rest he was getting; 03:06 when he was going to bed; definitely what other 03:09 foods he was eating and we looked at his type of exercise. 03:14 Now we set him up with a program that was designed 03:17 to help his mental performance - particularly eating foods 03:21 that would be designed to keep his cholesterol low; 03:23 foods that would feed the brain, like walnuts; 03:26 different foods like beans that feed the brain like 03:30 lima beans. 03:31 We gave him a lot of good foods that would keep his 03:35 inflammation down in his body 03:37 so that he wouldn't have high inflammation. 03:39 And then, we looked at how much water he was drinking. 03:42 We improved his water intake, so he was drinking 03:44 3 liters of water per day. 03:48 We also had him doing exercise the would boost 03:52 the neurotrophic factors to help his brain learn and grow. 03:57 And we'll talk about more things that we did for him, 04:00 but in the course of time, he took his test again. 04:04 Now he had his entire church praying for him 04:07 because this was D-day. 04:09 You miss this one, you know, he's gotta a wife and 04:12 two kids and none of them worked and had any income. 04:17 He was living with friends and so he needed to get 04:21 his income started. 04:23 Well, he went to take his test for this third time. 04:27 He actually called some of his classmates and told them 04:31 the Lord is going to help me do it this time. 04:33 "I'm going to pass." 04:35 Well he went to go take his test and it was a computerized 04:39 test and you take about 100 questions of the test, 04:44 and if you're missing a lot of them, it will keep throwing 04:47 more questions at you. 04:48 If you're getting them right, it will stop at 100. 04:51 Well it stopped at 100 and he went to look and see what 04:54 his score was and they gave him a score right away. 04:57 He had made 100% on his test! 05:01 Oh, that's amazing! That's amazing! 05:04 So you took a multifaceted approach to that. 05:07 There was the diet and the very particular diet for his needs, 05:12 and then the exercise, and the water and prayer, 05:16 so he had a lot of things going for him because when 05:19 I think of the mental, physical, spiritual, social, 05:22 you mentioned three of those areas where he was getting 05:25 specific and significant help in that period of time - the foods, 05:30 the water, the exercise in the physical part, 05:34 and then the spiritual part, so that was fantastic, 05:39 and I'm sure he was very relieved. 05:42 And talk about the stress - Jeni, this is very much 05:46 in your department, isn't it? 05:48 As your talking, I'm thinking, "Well he must have been 05:50 incredibly stressed. Oh yes. 05:51 I know stress reduces your capacity 05:54 for mental performance, but at the same time, 05:57 that last test would have been probably the most stressful 06:00 because if he didn't get it this time, he was out. 06:03 Three strikes and you're out. Yeah. 06:04 So it wasn't just stress, it was a problem, it had to be - 06:09 you know when you look at the cholesterol factor, 06:11 it had to be a big player for him in that. Definitely! 06:17 And when people eat good food, they're more able to handle 06:21 stress - they're less likely to overreact to stress. 06:25 And when they're exercising so that they are physiologically 06:29 in good shape, their body physiology doesn't respond 06:32 so dramatically to stress. 06:34 The heart rate doesn't go so high for example; 06:36 their breathing doesn't get so erratic. 06:39 It buffers the stress. 06:41 Which is wonderful because, see the thing is, 06:44 with the cholesterol and the oxygen factor would have been 06:46 a problem and the brain can grow and change and his 06:51 brain wasn't because it couldn't. 06:53 It was just sort of stuck in neutral, I guess you could say. 06:56 That's right! People with their diets make it so their 06:59 brain gets stuck where it is and they can't learn; 07:02 they can't grow; they can't develop; they don't come up 07:06 with new ways of dealing with stress. That's right. 07:08 And that's where I find when I'm working with people, 07:10 if they had that problem, I can't help them. 07:13 It doesn't matter what I do, they're not going to change, 07:15 and this is another reason I went into looking at the 07:18 mind-body connection and treating the whole system 07:20 because I found just trying to treat the 07:22 stress factor wasn't enough. 07:24 And people got more stressed because they're going, 07:26 "But I'm doing all these things and it's not making any 07:28 difference or I can't do it because I'm still stressed," 07:30 so we can see how important that holistic approach is. 07:34 So what you're saying is, by shifting the focus 07:36 to the physical things that they could do, 07:39 it took their mind off the stress, they were focusing 07:43 on the thing that was really... 07:44 And looking at brain food, the nutrients in 07:47 the brain is very important and getting that whole thing 07:51 going again because I can't help a starving brain 07:54 make a change or a brain that is clogged to make a change, 07:58 and that's sort of some of what we've been talking about here 08:00 because the brain can't grow. 08:03 No that's terrific that you're able to come at it from 08:06 both of those angles all in the one session. 08:08 You definitely get better results when you get the person 08:11 to make changes all around and not just do one thing, 08:14 and that's what you were doing. 08:16 So again this is something we all need to be aware of. 08:19 It's a holistic program and we need to treat every 08:21 part of our system. 08:22 That's right, mental, physical, spiritual and social. 08:25 John, you were talking about exercise - how much actually 08:28 did you recommend that he would do in this instance? 08:33 Now this was a gentleman that, of course, was fairly young 08:35 in his early 30s - he has no expectations that he's 08:42 going to have a heart attack immediately, and one of the 08:45 things you want to do if you want the brain to 08:47 particularly be able to learn new things is to 08:51 have what we call "BDNF," 08:54 brain, drive, neurotrophic factor. 08:56 And in order to get that to increase in the bloodstream, 09:00 you need some fairly vigorous aerobic exercise. 09:04 And so we sent him - he actually lived on a hill, 09:07 so I told him, "Jog to the bottom of the hill and 09:09 back at least once if not twice a day." 09:13 We also had him... 09:14 That wasn't Everest or anything like that, was it? 09:18 How far would that have been roughly? 09:20 I'm guessing that the elevation change over the top of his 09:23 hill to the bottom of the hill would be 09:25 about 100 to 120 meters. Alright. 09:29 That's a good run up and down a hill. 09:31 Yes and so the vigorous exercise of running down and up 09:35 would be enough to boost the BDNF and so that was part of it. 09:42 And then also, I had him on a program of studying, 09:45 I did spend some time with him going over study techniques 09:49 and what to focus on for his tests and so forth 09:53 which really is irrelevant to health, but in-between 09:57 times when he's doing his studying, I told him never 09:59 study for more than 30 minutes without taking a break 10:03 and at least a walk and where he lived, I said, "Well you know 10:06 you could walk down to that shed and over 10:08 to that trailer and then back again. 10:10 And so never sit there for more than 30 minutes. 10:13 It's interesting, when I was in college, I got a job 10:18 as a night watchman and I had several circuits I should 10:24 walk in order to complete my job and so I looked over 10:28 the campus that I was on that I was supposed 10:30 to cover all these buildings. 10:31 And I divided them up and I laid out my program 10:35 so 20 minutes - I'd be walking and then I'd stop and I'd 10:38 study for 20 minutes, and then 20 minutes I'd be walking, 10:41 and my brain was always fresh to study! Okay. 10:45 This 30 minutes, what's the reason for 10:49 cutting off at 30 minutes of studying? 10:52 You attention span isn't hardly longer than 20 minutes, 10:57 and your mental performance starts dropping at about 11:00 20 minutes and it's definitely dropped pretty low at 30 minutes 11:04 if you don't take a change of activity. Yes. 11:07 And you're much better off taking a break than just trying 11:10 to, you know, keep going. 11:13 And so this is very important for picking back up 11:16 the brain mental performance in between times. 11:22 So that was the aerobic part of his exercise, 11:25 was he doing more than that, that run down the hill and back? 11:29 Well he would then walk every 30 minutes 11:31 so that he never got tired. 11:33 The run was not every 20 minutes - he'd be a 11:38 marathoner after that. 11:39 I'm sorry, you did say that, yes. 11:41 So every 30 minutes he was to do some kind of exercise. 11:45 That would have added up to a fair amount during the day? 11:48 That's correct. 11:49 Yes and he was very diligent about following his program. 11:54 See the BDNF factor is huge because it's about 11:58 growing the brain and BDNF 12:01 is called "fertilizer" for the brain. 12:05 I don't know if that's a good term to put, 12:06 but fertilizer grows the brain. 12:08 And what it does, we have trillions of neurons, 12:12 trillions and trillions of them in the brain and they make up 12:16 pathways where we put inflammation along those 12:18 pathways and the more we act on the pathway, 12:21 the bigger that inflammation pathway gets and I actually 12:24 call them - they become freeways. Oh! 12:26 Now if you have an unhealthy one, it's not good and we want 12:29 a healthy one but the BDNF factor grows the memory 12:32 to help create the pathways. Oh okay. 12:35 And it stimulates neuronal growth, so that means it helps 12:38 the cells to grow and multiply, and it also helps the cells 12:42 or the neurons to connect, it's called "synapses" 12:45 and the synapses that connect to make the pathways. 12:48 So if you're going to put in and recall information, 12:50 you need good pathways and a good memory bank 12:53 to be able to put the new ones in and that's exactly what 12:56 this man was doing. 12:58 He was growing his brain but in doing that 13:01 there's a part of the brain, it's like a storehouse 13:03 for memory and it's called the "hippocampus" and it's 13:05 just below the or at the bottom of the brain area and there are 13:10 two areas we store memory; one is called the "amygdala" 13:14 which is our emotional memory and the other is the 13:17 "hippocampus" and they are right next to one another. 13:19 And what they do is they can change size, they can grow 13:23 to the point where they found that sometimes there are people 13:26 who have Alzheimer's who don't lose their memory as such, 13:29 and when they've done an autopsy, they found they had 13:32 a very big hippocampus and they had been highly active 13:35 in their life like this man had and they had actually 13:38 grown the hippocampus to the point where when the 13:40 Alzheimer's set in, they had so many memory cells 13:44 ready to use that they didn't lose them all. 13:46 Isn't that interesting? 13:48 It's a very powerful thing, so we all want to grow 13:50 the brain and this is exactly what we do. Yes. 13:55 You think there's enough room in there? Laughter. 13:57 You mean you're going to get a big head. 14:01 But that's fantastic because they didn't always think 14:03 that that could happen - it's not that long ago, is it? 14:06 No, they used to think that once we were born, 14:10 the brain had all these cells, trillion of cells, 14:12 and as we got older, they'd die and we'd lose brain capacity, 14:15 but that's not true. No. 14:17 We can grow the brain. 14:18 Isn't that wonderful! Oh it is. 14:19 It's wonderful to think that we can actually do that. 14:22 And, yes, this is an important thing to remember 14:27 because I've had one family bring to me the husband 14:31 and father and he was getting Alzheimer's. 14:34 I mean, he didn't believe he was getting Alzheimer's. They don't! 14:39 But his wife and his kids are like, "Yeah, he forgets; 14:42 he changes; he's got this going on and that." 14:45 And so, again I sat down with him and took a history of 14:48 what he was eating and it was a lot of high cholesterol 14:50 foods, foods with cholesterol and foods 14:52 that would drive up his cholesterol. Right. 14:54 And we did a similar thing where we took him off 14:57 all of those things, especially free oils which decrease 15:02 the amount of oxygen on the brain. 15:04 And again, we put him on the walnuts and the flax, 15:08 and coconut and brain foods, but the added thing we had 15:14 for him, we had him doing some hydrotherapy on his head, 15:16 but we also had him exercising the mental part of his brain. 15:21 We had him work on memorizing and the best thing he could 15:26 memorize was Bible passages. Okay. 15:29 And so I'd have him pick his Bible passages and memorize 15:33 them and work on it every day. 15:36 And then the other thing that really helps the brain is 15:39 exercising it in studying in comparing similar things, 15:44 we call it "the associations." 15:46 And so we had him studying the Bible where he would look at 15:49 one passage and compare it with another. 15:52 For example, maybe he would go to where Jesus says, "Come 15:56 unto Me all ye that labor and I will give you rest." 16:00 Okay, "rest." Well he then is supposed to associate 16:03 with other things in the Bible where it talks about "rest." 16:05 Oh, well then there's the Sabbath day that is for rest. 16:09 And then there's Hebrews where it says, "There's a rest 16:11 that remains the people of God." 16:14 And then, well then there's the opposite in Revelation, 16:16 it says, "The wicked HAVE no rest." 16:19 Anyway, the idea is to keep comparing different 16:22 similar thoughts throughout the Bible so he could 16:26 increase the mental performance. 16:28 Well I was giving a talk on Alzheimer's a couple of years 16:34 later and I thought, "I wonder what happened to that guy, 16:36 I gotta call him before my talk so I know, 16:38 do I have a... Yeah! 16:40 Have a living example, basically. 16:41 Hopefully he's done some good in his example. 16:44 And sure enough, his wife said, "You know, when he's on that 16:47 program, he's back to normal, he has no deficits, but if he 16:52 goes down to the fast food joint and eats some kind of 16:54 cholesterol-containing food, he's in trouble." 16:58 Really? So in other words, he could come back to normal 17:00 and then switch backwards and forwards, are you saying that? 17:04 Yes, to a certain degree. 17:06 Oh, goodness me. 17:08 It is a "use it or lose it principle" with the brain. 17:11 If we don't use the brain, the cells start to die 17:13 and drop out - we lose those pathways there. 17:16 The interesting thing is we never totally lose a pathway 17:20 or what is a belief or an attitude or a memory, 17:23 it's actually housed in the outer area of the brain, 17:26 around the outer core of the brain and they are like 17:30 dormant memories. 17:31 So for someone, for example, who has a habit that they 17:34 wanted to change - it might be reading or what we do 17:39 or it might be people who smoke or drink or whatever, 17:42 and they stop - they can find further down the track 17:44 where they absentmindedly do it because 17:46 that habit is still there. 17:48 But if you feed it, it will grow but if you go, "Hang on 17:50 I don't do that anymore," you'll find that it will 17:53 start to dissipate and the cells are actually dropping out 17:57 and that memory goes into that dormant space 17:59 but it can be activated. 18:01 So he would have had lots of memories there and what 18:03 he is doing is activating them instead of letting them 18:06 dissipate. Yes. 18:08 Now John, what about the medications that control 18:12 cholesterol, would that give people 18:14 a good mental performance if they controlled their 18:16 cholesterol that way? 18:18 You'd think so, wouldn't you? 18:19 You get the cholesterol down, we know that cholesterol, 18:22 as we've discussed here, causes mental performance 18:24 issues but in reality they've discovered that the cholesterol 18:31 pills actually decrease mental performance. 18:35 So I often ask the question, "Well, if you had high 18:38 cholesterol and your brain function was suffering, 18:41 would you know any difference if you started taking a 18:43 pill that also caused brain function problems and even 18:49 though it lowered your cholesterol? 18:51 I have a friend who had high cholesterol, she decided 18:55 "You know, I've struggled through it with this 18:57 all my life, I think I should go ahead and go on 18:59 the medication because the studies show that 19:03 if your cholesterol is high, you've got 19:04 problems - it's better if it's low." 19:07 So they started taking that medication, 19:09 and one day we went driving down the freeway 19:13 and all of a sudden they realized they had missed 19:15 their exit two exits back. 19:17 And then we went driving up another way and they 19:20 totally forgot where they were and this wasn't like them. 19:23 And I'm like what's going on? 19:24 Well, they're taking this statin drug that lowers cholesterol, 19:28 but these statin drugs are not without their side effects. 19:35 So you think you're doing yourself a great deal of good, 19:37 but in reality, they also lower your immune system. 19:40 We talked about the immune system in another program, 19:42 they depress your immune system so much, that they 19:47 have been used in transplanting organs as immunosuppressor 19:50 to good effect. Wow! Oh my goodness! 19:53 That's powerful! 19:55 Oh and we're not told that? 19:58 I mean people take things trustingly, don't they, 20:03 and don't realize all of that. 20:05 I know they do print out big sheets of side effects, 20:08 but that's really bad. 20:10 Just going back to your first story, tell us a bit more 20:14 about why you selected some of the foods that you did 20:17 for that young man who needed to pass his exam. 20:21 Yes, one of the things we wanted to do is make sure 20:24 his brain had good oxygenation which means good flow. 20:29 So like for breakfast, we'd have him eating lots of good 20:32 fresh fruit, particularly things like pineapple and grapefruit, 20:37 both of which improve blood flow. 20:40 We would also make sure he was getting the essential 20:43 fatty acids - both omega 3 and some of the others, 20:46 and that's why we gave him like walnuts. 20:49 We had him eating certain things like flax and then 20:53 there are certain foods that boost neurotransmitters. 20:56 And so beans, such as lima beans and soybeans which 21:01 improve certain things like serotonin and dopamine, 21:06 and things like that. 21:08 And so we made sure that his food was such as would 21:12 feed his brain and it wouldn't clog his brain. 21:16 And then another factor here is we made sure he 21:19 stayed on schedule. 21:20 This is a huge thing we really haven't gotten into but 21:23 people who eat at the same time every day, 21:25 like if they're going to eat breakfast at 7:00, 21:27 they always eat at 7:00, come weekend or week day, 21:30 they have lower cholesterols and better digestion; 21:33 they eat less food; they have less diabetes. 21:36 There's a lot of important things for the brain 21:38 about staying on schedule, your brain runs on a schedule. 21:42 Your brain has circadian rhythms. 21:45 Well it's hard for people to stay on schedule and 21:48 I find when I'm working with people and I try and get 21:50 them to do a schedule, they really struggle and it's 21:53 hard for them to stay on track 21:55 unless they're a very disciplined person. 21:57 So that's something that's a real challenge 21:58 for most people too. Yes. 22:00 And by eating on schedule, what times are we talking 22:04 about here to get someone to religiously do this? 22:08 Basically, I tell people to figure out in their schedule 22:12 what are the immovable appointments and then 22:15 establish a schedule for their eating around that, 22:17 that they can keep seven days a week. 22:21 And it doesn't matter how many, there are certain optimal times, 22:24 but that doesn't necessarily mean everybody can do it, 22:26 but if your breakfast is 8:30, always at 8:30 22:30 from weekend to week day. 22:32 Same is true of going to bed and getting up. 22:35 We had him established on a very strict schedule - always 22:38 go to bed and for people wanting their brain to 22:41 function better, getting hours before midnight 22:43 are extremely important for your melatonin. Absolutely! 22:48 And the melatonin is its own, well, it's your body's 22:52 anti-inflammatory hormone! 22:55 It also sets that clock for them to get a good sleep and to 22:59 let the whole body clock do the right cycle. 23:02 So I know that with people I work with insomnia, 23:05 if they don't do that, the melatonin cycle is going to 23:08 malfunction and then they'll have insomnia. 23:11 And insomnia will definitely knock out your mental 23:13 performance the next day. 23:16 Yes, it's a whole range of things, isn't it? 23:19 Another thing we were doing in this program was having 23:22 him drink lots of water and people don't realize 23:26 when they're behind on water that by the time you are 23:28 thirsty, you're already 30% down. 23:32 And now you think about a jug of water or a tank of water, 23:37 when the water starts to decrease in the tank, 23:40 where does the water go? 23:42 Down - the level drops. 23:45 Well where is the top of your water level in your body? 23:47 Your brain! 23:49 So people who are dehydrated, their brain shrinks, 23:53 and their mental performance suffers. It does. 23:56 And they end up not being able to think. 23:58 And so a well-hydrated brain is key to keeping 24:03 the neurofunctions going. 24:04 Also, it's true that when you drink plenty of water 24:07 and you're not dehydrated, you can raise your 24:09 blood volume by 6% and, therefore, you're diluting 24:13 out things in your bloodstream by 6% including cholesterol. 24:17 So you have a relative drop in cholesterol 24:19 due to being well-hydrated. Yes. 24:21 John, what are the foods that contain cholesterol 24:24 because obviously, if we're to eliminate cholesterol 24:27 we need to be very clear the source of cholesterol in foods. 24:31 And we're going to do a whole topic here on cholesterol 24:35 and lowering it, but you might be surprised to find out 24:39 that it's not just the foods you eat WITH cholesterol 24:42 which are a problem - it takes a liver to make cholesterol 24:45 so if your food had a liver or a mother or whatever, 24:49 then you know it has cholesterol. 24:50 A chicken has cholesterol, an avocado doesn't have a 24:53 mother, doesn't have a liver, so it doesn't have cholesterol. 24:56 But it's also true that anything you eat that's high in fat 25:01 whether it has cholesterol or not, 25:04 will raise your cholesterol. 25:06 Also, any animal protein, even people working out 25:10 in the gym trying to get extra protein by drinking 25:12 these high protein shakes that are largely some part of the 25:16 milk protein like casein or whey - the milk protein 25:22 even in the absence of fat or cholesterol will tell 25:27 your liver to produce more cholesterol 25:31 and you'll have a high cholesterol. 25:33 And so any animal protein, be it white meat, 25:36 be it red meat, whatever - will raise your cholesterol 25:39 even if they've done something to lower the actual 25:41 cholesterol content of that meat. 25:44 I've been told seafood is high in cholesterol - your 25:47 crustaceans and that's a very popular food for a lot 25:50 of people - prawns and crayfish. True. 25:53 Yes, so this is where people have to make massive 25:56 changes if they really want to watch 25:58 their cholesterol levels and improve on that. 26:01 Yes, so the plant foods, it comes back to plant foods 26:04 again, doesn't it? 26:05 Whole plant foods are the ones to aim at. 26:08 And when you eat cholesterol, unlike when your liver 26:13 makes cholesterol, it's very hard to keep that cholesterol 26:17 that coming through your mouth from coming in contact 26:19 with air and getting oxidized. Yes! 26:22 Oxidized cholesterol then increases brain inflammation, 26:27 and when the brain is inflamed, you end up with more 26:31 functional deficits and especially with Alzheimer's, 26:35 Parkinson's and all the other neurodegenerative diseases. 26:40 A major contributor to mental illness with depression, 26:43 anxiety disorders, it's all brain inflammation and again, 26:46 there's that problem with medication because some of 26:49 these medications like your antidepressants 26:52 can inflame the brain which is really counteracting 26:56 what the brain needs to deal with the depression. 26:59 It's the same sort of principle. 27:02 So another thing we had him doing is we had him 27:08 breaking his day up and we might talk a little more about that. 27:12 People who get into a rut and spend a lot of time on 27:16 one thing, become less and less efficient and then they start 27:19 thinking, "I'm not very good at this," and then they 27:22 start getting depressed. That's right! 27:25 That's when they come and see me and then we have to look 27:28 at what is depression and when it's something to do with 27:31 what they're eating and their lifestyle, if that doesn't 27:34 change, the medication does not do the job, 27:37 so they have to change what you're talking about. 27:39 Yeah, then it might be so simple as they need to take 27:41 a break more often. Yes! 27:43 That's a tremendously simple thing to do and it's 27:47 refreshing, isn't it? 27:48 It's refreshing to take a break. 27:50 Well like some people I know, it's not, they like to just 27:54 do something endlessly and that's just their personality. 27:57 Well thank you so much, both of you for your input today, 28:01 and that's our program for today. 28:03 If you'd like a fact sheet of the program or you'd like 28:06 to watch our programs on demand, just visit our website at: 28:10 3abnaustralia.org.au 28:13 and click the watch button. 28:15 And John and Jenifer are happy to answer your questions 28:18 personally - just email them at: 28:20 healthyliving@3abnaustralia.org .au 28:24 Join us next time on "Healthy Living!" |
Revised 2019-08-27