Participants: Don Mackintosh (Host), John Clark
Series Code: HFAL
Program Code: HFAL000197
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00:01 The following program presents principles designed
00:03 to promote good health and is not intended to take 00:06 the place of personalized professional care. 00:09 The opinions and ideas expressed are those of the 00:11 speaker. Viewers are encouraged to draw their 00:14 own conclusions about the information presented. 00:50 Hello and welcome to Health For A Lifetime, 00:52 I'm your host Don Mackintosh. Today, we are 00:54 gonna talk about maybe many of you are 00:56 experiencing and that's low back pain and talking 00:59 with us about this is Dr. John Clark, he is an 01:02 orthopedic surgeon and they see you when they 01:04 wanna get rid of the low back pain. Yeah, 01:06 that's right. Is this, how, how, how many people 01:11 are struggling with this in America? You know, 01:14 probably lot more people than we know, but those 01:17 who have come to medical attention about 20% 01:20 of the population this year will have an episode of 01:24 low back pain. Over a lifetime, 80% of people 01:28 experience low back pain. That's a lot. That's a lot 01:33 it's is also very expensive for workers compensation, 01:36 is the number one most expensive diagnosis for 01:39 workers' compensation. So, I mean this is an 01:41 obvious question, but what is your most memorable 01:45 patient that you have seen with low back pain. 01:48 Well, you know, I saw one recently that comes to 01:51 mind. So, gentlemen who had five years earlier had 01:56 an episode where he slipped and fell while carrying a 01:59 heavy object at work. And the pain in his back 02:04 was excruciating, he had drove him to go see the 02:06 doctor after he saw the doctor, they did an MRI and 02:09 they decided he needed a surgery. They took him to 02:13 surgery, took out a disc and he has had for six 02:16 months after that. He did fine, but then it was all the 02:20 same again. And the pain was driving him to seek more 02:25 medical help, he had gotten more MRIs and so finally 02:28 they said there is nothing more we can do. 02:31 Well, then he came to see me for a second opinion 02:33 to see what he could figure out. He was telling me 02:36 that he no longer had energy to do anything, 02:39 he had this low aching pain in his back, he couldn't 02:42 go out with his kids and play basketball, and he is 02:45 wishing he could. He was in his early 50s and his 02:48 kids were in their teenage years and he was just 02:50 feeling like he is getting left out. I think he was 02:53 really coming to me because he wanted disability. 02:57 But you didn't give him disability. You, you must 03:00 have suggested something else or you wouldn't tell 03:02 me the story. Yeah, I don't see disability as the 03:06 best solution necessarily and so I talked with him a 03:10 little bit and discussed with him what was happening, 03:13 I did an exam I could tell there was nothing that was, 03:17 you know, pressing as far as a neurological deficit or 03:21 anything. The low back pain was in the middle of his 03:24 back, it radiated little bit down to the side of his 03:28 back and, and pelvis, sometimes to his legs. 03:34 He told me that he was working at a job, 03:36 where he stock shelves in a local department store 03:40 and he was getting to where he couldn't do that 03:43 anymore, it was starting to really bug him. 03:46 So, what do you tell him to do? Well, I decided to 03:50 talk to him about this. I said, now sir you know, 03:53 you have got this big problem you had it for five 03:55 years it's destroying your life. Would you be willing 03:58 to try something just for one week? I mean even 04:01 if it was really, you know, difficult and challenging, 04:04 but maybe we can get you through this and he 04:06 said sure I'll try anything for one week. I said, 04:08 you know, you know, there is a program we will 04:11 try for one week and, and at the end of that week 04:14 I'll reevaluate you and see how you are doing. 04:17 So, he says okay. So, I said, alright. First thing, 04:21 I want you to do is draw the schedule here for me. 04:27 Now, I talked him about his lifestyle, his diet and 04:28 everything. So, I kind of knew what he was already 04:30 doing. Okay. And so I started down the schedule 04:33 I said the first thing you do when you get up in the 04:35 morning as I want you to drink two glasses of water. 04:41 Two glasses of water or more, it might be good for 04:43 people watching to take down this and they can try 04:44 it for a week, right? That's right, if you are having 04:47 low back pain. Two glasses of water; start up. 04:49 That's right, two glasses of water and as soon as you 04:53 get up in the morning start the hydration early. 04:56 Okay. And then when you eat breakfast I want you 04:59 to eat something specific for breakfast. I asked him 05:02 if he had ever eaten oatmeal. He says, oh, yeah, 05:04 I have. I said, alright I want you to eat oatmeal 05:07 for breakfast. All week. All week. For the first 05:10 week. First week. I told him now this is a necessarily 05:14 the way you are gonna live the rest of your life. 05:16 But this week. But this week you are on a therapeutic 05:19 program. Alright. So, he said okay, I said now with 05:21 your oatmeal, I don't want you to put oils on it, 05:24 butter, margarine or anything like that. Any dates. 05:28 You can put in a few dates or raisins, but and keep the 05:31 salt to minimum, no sugar. Okay. Because we wanna 05:34 really avoid refined things and then as soon as 05:39 you finish eating breakfast. I want you to take a 05:43 walk for 10 minutes. And that's after each meal of 05:47 the day, you know, and so 10 minute walk in the 05:50 open air even if it's raining or snowing just put on 05:53 appropriate clothing, get outside also with each 05:57 meal take 500 mg of vitamin C, and then between 06:04 breakfast and lunch about two hours after 06:08 breakfast I want you to take two more glasses of water, 06:14 but avoid drinking with your meals just drink your 06:16 water between meals. Now, if you are used to 06:18 eating between meals I told him and you start 06:21 getting hungry, drink a glass of ice water, and just 06:26 douche the stomach in cold water and it usually 06:28 fixes the problem. Then when you get the lunch time 06:32 on your special program for this week, I want you 06:34 to eat nothing but vegetables preferably raw as much 06:38 as you want, but don't eat vegetables that have 06:42 lots of oils or salt. You can eat cooked vegetables, 06:46 but make sure they are not overly, they have sugar 06:51 with them or oil with them and then on your salad 06:54 make sure you don't eat too much salad dressing, 06:56 low fat if you have to have some or else make a 06:58 good dressing and then of course with your lunch, 07:01 your vitamin C, your 10 minute walk between lunch 07:04 and supper another two glasses of water. 07:09 And for supper I want you to eat nothing, 07:12 but fruit preferably fresh fruit. Fruit that is in his 07:17 natural state as possible with all the fiber, 07:20 no refining, no juices, and eat at least three hours 07:26 before bedtime, take your vitamin C, walk immediately 07:30 after supper for 10 minutes and then between supper 07:34 and bedtime, drink your two glasses of water again 07:38 that will make a total of 8 glasses of water for the day. 07:41 Eight glasses and then what are the 1500 mg of 07:45 vitamin C? That's right, lot's of vitamin C, lots of 07:49 water, good diet, lots of exercise and then I told 07:53 him be sure you avoid things like coffee, tea, 07:58 alcohol, things that would give you back trouble. 08:03 And so that was the program that I put him on and 08:06 I send him out of the office. So, why did you tell 08:09 him to drink so much water? Well, you know, 08:13 the discs in your back are largely made out of 08:18 water and we can put up a graphic here and on our 08:22 graphic we have a picture of a vertebrae above 08:25 and a vertebrae below, and I've colored the middle 08:28 disc yellow. Those discs are made up of about 70 08:33 to 80% water. For in the water your disc kind a 08:36 shrinks. That's right, it's like a tire that runs out 08:39 of air, your disc runs out of water and most people 08:43 live their lives in dehydration. Now, if we put 08:46 up the next graphic, the point there is that if you 08:50 look at the disc it only has a blood supply to the 08:55 edge of it to the, what we call the annulus. 08:59 And when the blood supplies the annulus, 09:02 the rest of the disc is dependent upon diffusion or 09:06 soaking through of the nutrients into the disc and 09:10 the oxygen into the disc and all has to soak 09:13 through and or pump through by the action of 09:17 your walking. These discs are especially vulnerable 09:22 to dehydration to poor nutrition to anything 09:25 that affects the vessels running to them. 09:28 So, drinking plenty of water keeps the disc full, 09:31 it keeps the medium in the disc that lets nutrients 09:34 flow from the vessels to the centre of it. So, you have 09:38 plan, you had to drink a lot of water, so the enough 09:40 water to send, if you had a walk, so it pushes and 09:43 squeezes it through there by diffusion these were the 09:46 ideas. That's exactly right. And then let me guess, 09:50 the oatmeal and all of the healthy food was, 09:52 the vessels would be nice and clean and deliver 09:55 everything he needs for his disc. That's exactly 09:58 right, and to talk little bit more about the walking. 10:02 The reason I had him walk after each meal was 10:05 because when you just finished eating, 10:09 you have a lot of nutrients pouring out of your 10:14 stomach, out of your intestines into your blood 10:16 stream. And if the blood becomes stagnate during 10:19 that period of time, it tends to slug up and that 10:24 decreases the oxygen and nutrients to the disc. 10:29 Also walking as it pumps the disc helps to move 10:33 nutrients in and out of the disc, further if you are 10:36 walking out in the open air; you have a lot higher 10:39 oxygen in your bloodstream. And as the oxygen 10:43 that were trying to get to these discs, to get 10:46 these cells active again, pumped up and fluffy. 10:49 Pumped up and fluffy, so that they end up healing 10:52 any damage done to the disc and that they also 10:56 remove irritations, waste products. So, why no oil 11:01 or sugar for breakfast. Oils and sugar. 11:04 I usually have my oatmeal and my brown sugar, 11:06 so why did you take that away from me? 11:08 Well, because I'm mean. No, really because the 11:12 sugar in the diet. You know, we won't created 11:15 the sugar, you have to go look in for the sugar in 11:17 order to find it the way you find is you have to boil 11:20 down a whole bunch of sugarcane or beets or 11:22 something and then you make this white chemical 11:25 looking stuff that's granular and you put in your 11:27 food is not really good for it. We can talk a lot 11:31 about that, but sugar when it gets in the 11:33 bloodstream does a couple of things, one when 11:37 you eat high glycemic index foods that is foods that 11:40 have a lot of sugar. Foods that put a lot of 11:42 sugar in the bloodstream fast; it creates the 11:47 environment for sugar to stick to proteins permanently. 11:51 We called it glycosylation. When the sugar sticks 11:55 to the vessels that surround the disc, then the disc 11:59 cannot get nutrients because the nutrients can't 12:02 go by the sugar barrier. When the sugar gets high 12:05 in the bloodstream it sticks to the red blood 12:08 cells and they become stuck together or what 12:12 we called glycosylated, hemoglobin A1C is what we 12:16 called it and you can test for it, but when you get 12:19 these, the sugar sticking all over everything 12:21 pretty soon blood cells stick to the sides of blood 12:25 vessels, the sugar doesn't allow nutrients to pass 12:28 from the blood cell to the blood vessel to the adjacent 12:32 tissues. It's a big problem, further the blood cells 12:36 all stick together, it becomes stacked up, 12:39 the affect we called a Rulo effect. Rulo. Rulo 12:44 is kind of a French word, its kind a like that, 12:46 I like. Roulette, like Roulette. Well, I don't know 12:49 about that's right, but anyway the cells all stick 12:52 together in a stack and they won't make it 12:55 through the capillaries like they should. 12:57 So, you have, you gave him the water, you gave him 13:01 this diet with no sugar, but also no fat, 13:06 no oils you said. That's right; oils have the same 13:10 affect of sugars of causing the cells to all 13:13 stack together. Okay, so they make it viscous and 13:16 doesn't get the oxygen or other nutrients there. 13:19 That's right. Okay, well I want to see what 13:22 happens with this man. And I'm sure everybody 13:23 else does too. So, when we comeback we are 13:25 gonna talk about the vitamin C and about some of 13:28 these other things you have talked about and 13:30 then I think it's gonna be a good result. 13:33 Maybe we can go through that list again too when 13:34 we comeback because people out there, they are 13:36 beginning to understand they say, may I wanna 13:38 make that list and say, I'm gonna try that for 13:41 one week. We hope you can join us when we comeback. 13:46 Are you confused about the endless strain 13:48 with new and often contradictory health 13:50 information? With companies trying to sell 13:53 new drugs and special interest groups paying 13:55 for studies this been the fact, 13:58 where can you find a common sense approach 13:59 to health. One way is to ask for your free copy of 14:03 Dr. Arnott's 24 realistic ways to improve your 14:06 health. Dr. Timothy Arnott in the Lifestyle Center 14:09 of America produced this helpful booklet of 14:11 24 short practical health tips based on scientific 14:14 research and the Bible that will help you live 14:17 longer, happier, and healthier. For example, 14:20 did you know that women who drink more 14:22 water lower the risk of heart attack or the 14:24 seven to eight hours of sleep a night can 14:26 minimize your risk of ever developing diabetes? 14:29 Find out how to lower your blood pressure 14:31 and much more if you are looking for help, 14:33 now hire them this book works for you. 14:35 Just log on to 3abn.org and click on free offers 14:39 or call us during regular business 14:41 hours, we will be glad you did. 14:45 Welcome back we have been talking with 14:46 Dr. John Clark, we are talking about low back pain, 14:49 it afflicts many Americans 20% this year and 80% 14:54 at sometime during their lifetime and it is a 14:58 huge problem in the workplace, it's workmen's 15:02 comp number one thing that people complain 15:04 about or that leads to those work comp claim, 15:07 so I'm sure that there is a lot of occupational 15:10 medicine doctors and what not the see a lot 15:12 of this, but you do too as an orthopedic surgeon. 15:14 That's right. And we have been talking about 15:17 this man that came in and you, he was about 15:20 ready to call it quits in his early 50s, gets in his 15:24 teens, was the stock person who couldn't really 15:26 make it, was wondering what he was gonna do and 15:29 you said, hey are you willing to try something for a 15:30 week and then you outlined this program he was 15:33 going through, which is basically. Well, I think 15:37 we have a list of it. We can look through it and 15:38 summarize it again. And we will look at that list 15:42 and then we will catch up to what we were and we 15:45 were looking at some of these different areas 15:47 that you were talking about we will pick that up 15:49 again. So, if you had that list we will look at it and 15:52 we will, we will see what your recommendation was. 15:54 For breakfast, I think it was you said wake up in 15:56 the morning, two glasses of water when you get 15:59 up. Upon arising. Then breakfast plain oatmeal, 16:05 you can put a few dates in it if you want it, 16:07 but no sugar we talked about why? Vitamin C 500 mg 16:13 and then for lunch. I think he walked right after 16:18 breakfast as well too, isn't that correct? Yes. 16:20 And then you could drink a couple of glasses 16:24 after, after, after breakfast sometime there couple 16:26 of hours afterwards. In lunch, vegetables of any 16:30 kind raw preferred no oils or different things on 16:33 them, we talked about why? You would want to put 16:36 it that on them. Vitamin C 500 mg and then right 16:40 after the meal walk again, so that all those vitamins 16:43 and nutrients could get out there. And then two 16:46 glasses of water mid morning or this would be mid 16:51 afternoon I think, right after lunch. Supper, 16:54 raw fruit, three hours before bedtime you want 16:57 them to eat. Again vitamin C 500 mg, 10 minutes 17:02 walking right after the meal and then two glasses of 17:05 water, two hours after supper and then at 17:09 bedtime, no coffee, tea, sodas, alcohol, tobacco 17:14 generally no eating between meals, drink ice water if 17:18 you get hungry in between the meals because 17:20 it kind a just sterns the stomach. I guess and take 17:25 that's away, is that right, is that a fair summary? 17:28 That's a fair summary Don. Okay, so now we were 17:30 talking about you know, we talked about the water, 17:33 we talked about why no sugar, why no oil, 17:36 but vitamin C you are getting them 1500 mg a day. 17:42 You know, what's the purpose with that, isn't the 17:43 water soluble or they just urinating out all the 17:46 vitamin C. That's a good question Don and, you know, 17:50 I didn't give it to him all in the morning. Okay. 17:52 Or at night because your body can only absorb 17:56 about so much vitamin C at a time anyway and 17:59 500 mg is about you can handle. Now, vitamin C has 18:03 a number of beneficial effects for the back. 18:06 It's actually been written up in some medical 18:09 articles. But the vitamin C is important to collagen 18:14 healing. It's an important vitamin to help the collagen 18:18 to repair in actually making the collagen. 18:21 Also vitamin C is an acid; ascorbic acid it's a 18:25 lot like aspirin in a sense that it's an acid, 18:28 it actually thins the blood a little bit like aspirin 18:31 too, which helps the circulation to some of these 18:35 discs that we talked about that only have 18:37 circulation to their outer edges. So, it works on 18:43 the collagen area as well vitamin C? Yeah, it's very 18:47 important for collagen synthesis. So, 500 mg any 18:52 particular kind, just any kind you get? Yeah, 18:54 pick your favorite one. Okay, you tell him to walk 18:58 for 10 minutes after each meal, I think that's, 19:01 that's an elimination nourishment cycle. 19:04 That's right, you know, the whole body works on 19:06 cycles. You know, as we said, don't eat 19:08 between meals either. Your body is made to 19:11 work on cycles, your heart pumps and as you walk 19:17 you know, you don't go on roller skates and roll 19:19 you actually pump your whole body, isn't that 19:21 interesting? It pumps blood up from your feet 19:25 to walk on your feet. There is a lot of aspects 19:28 about movement that your body benefits from. 19:31 In this case, we want you to move so the disc 19:33 pumps and it actually does pump, they have done 19:36 studies, large molecules like nutrients don't make 19:41 it into the disc very well unless the disc because 19:43 it actually being pumped. And so the walk helps 19:47 with that, not only that the walk is important for 19:50 increasing the oxygen in your bloodstream and 19:53 that's important for your disc. So, action is 19:57 really a law of life. That's right. You've got to be 20:00 on the move. Okay, so these things seem very 20:03 simple obvious, but they are really quite significant 20:07 when we looked at them, they really, there is 20:09 really some anatomy and also physiology by 20:12 how the body works here that where these 20:14 principles are built on, this wasn't just some 20:16 flipped remark to someone that was trying to 20:18 get workmen's comp, this was really trying to help 20:20 them. Oh! That's right, that's exactly right, 20:23 you know, as we said each supper at least 20:24 three hours before bedtime. Right. And eat only 20:27 fruit, you see when a person eats a large heavy 20:32 meal late at night it really keeps the whole 20:36 system stuffed up all night. And so the discs 20:40 again suffer because the system is slugged up 20:43 with food particles and nutrients that are 20:46 overloaded and, and everything is going 20:50 slowly and the discs aren't happy with that, 20:55 your body spends all night trying to digest the 20:58 food and it doesn't have that cycling of food 21:02 and then rest, food and then rest. Also none of us, 21:06 we picked foods that were all natural that 21:08 would have their fiber with them. Lot of people 21:11 gets low back pain because they have a 21:13 load of food in their stomach that is three days 21:15 old and is putting enough toxins and you know the 21:18 stomach is very close to the back. And you 21:22 end up with these pains; some back pain is just 21:24 pain from the abdomen. Now, you talked about 21:28 no snacking, no coffee, no caffeinated type things 21:32 or sodas between meals. That's right, you see 21:37 when we talk about these discs, the discs aren't 21:40 that important to the body when they body is 21:43 worried about fight or flight, if you are worried 21:46 about fight or flight, the body wants the blood 21:49 reserve approach the body that are very important 21:53 the brain, the heart, you know, different things 21:56 like that. And it shunts blood away from the 22:00 discs. This also happens, if you have a lot 22:03 of stress in your life. The stress will tend 22:06 to tell the discs to shut down the blood to them. 22:11 The way this works is through the sympathetic, 22:14 parasympathetic nervous systems. 22:16 People who are under more stress tend to 22:17 have more back pain. People who have a lot 22:20 of issues in their life that they are dealing with 22:22 will have more back pain. I used to have a 22:25 student from a Local University, who had come 22:27 to me for his back pain every test week. 22:31 And it point toward the back pain he was in, 22:34 and after a couple returns I started ask him, 22:36 what's happening this week, oh! It's test week. 22:39 And I started picking up that this was a stress 22:41 related phenomenon. Part of taking a walk in 22:45 the outdoors after each meal is about relieving 22:48 stress. So, you tell this guy never to take tests 22:51 or what? Well, I don't think it would have work; 22:55 there is something's you can't tell people, 22:57 won't you. You know, that's an interesting point 22:59 you bring up though because in I think in Psalm 23:01 32, when David was having the terrible problems 23:05 that he had brought upon himself by having a 23:08 relationship with so many he shouldn't have 23:09 had. He said, you know, when I kept silent my 23:12 bones growl throughout my groaning all the day 23:15 you know. That was interesting. And the hand 23:16 was heavy upon me, so for about a year I 23:19 guess we figured out you know, Psalm 32 23:22 coupled with Psalm 51, we realize that he was 23:25 really going through that, so he was experiencing 23:28 probably low back pain at least some kind of 23:30 pain in his bones because of that. That's right, 23:33 you know, studies have shown that people who 23:36 are under stress especially if the stress is related 23:40 to childhood abuse have a higher incidence of 23:43 low back pain. That's right, so like you know, 23:45 you got your firemen, let's say, you know, 23:50 I have got a friend who is a chapel for firemen, 23:52 I used to be a paramedic and everything, 23:54 these people are under terrible stress, but they 23:56 also have all kinds of back problems, we usually 23:58 associated just with the kind of lifting their joint, 24:01 but we are suggesting is it could be actually 24:03 related to the stress itself. That's right, 24:06 you know, we have people who injure their 24:08 backs and are being lifelong involute. Well, 24:12 that's interesting because bones heal in the 24:15 matter of weeks, ligaments tendons and joints heal 24:19 in a matter of you know, few months, 24:21 well why are they spending the rest of the 24:23 life with pain. So, this man he was like, 24:27 you have given him like a seven day test, 24:29 you went quite Daniel one with the 10 days, 24:30 test but your seven day test with kind of Daniel's 24:34 diet here, what happened when he came back 24:37 to your office, was he, what were the results? 24:42 Well, you know, I thought he would leave and 24:44 just go home and say, Oh fooly, what's that 24:47 doctor think that he is a nut, well anyway he went 24:50 home and he was gone and he came back in a week 24:53 and as he walked down the hall, I tried to watch 24:56 him, to see what. His gait was like. What his gait 25:00 was like and I can't tell a whole lot, he was, 25:02 was like and I can't tell a whole lot, he was, 25:03 you know, he is kind a hit his feelings well and I 25:05 just couldn't tell I was thinking okay well. Get out 25:08 the disability papers. Well, he came in, he sat 25:11 down and says, well so how do you go, he said, 25:14 you know, within three days, I could tell a 25:17 dramatic difference, I no longer had that died 25:22 heavy tired feeling in my back, but you know I 25:26 peed an awful lot. You know, I ended up 25:28 drinking a lot of ice water because I was always 25:30 hungry because I'm used to eating between meals 25:34 and he says, I didn't feel a lot, but during breaks 25:37 I was wide awake when everybody else was 25:39 asleep. And he says, I had no trouble on my jobs, 25:44 stocking shelves, he says, this is just you know, 25:46 great thank you so much. Is that right? 25:49 So, just one week, this is definitely worth to try, 25:52 Isn't it? it's definitely worth to try, you know, 25:54 one week you think what happened after 25:56 that three months later, I went to that 25:58 department store where he works and there 26:01 he was pushing a big cart with a bunch of 26:03 boxes and i said, hey! How you are doing? 26:05 And he looked at me and he says, Oh! 26:07 Dr. Clark, he says, yeah. Well, I'm doing quite fine 26:11 you know, I'm you know, I feel better now 26:14 then I have in months. And he says, I'm staying 26:16 with the program, there are some other things 26:18 I'm not sticking with this course I probably should, 26:20 but I'm doing the exercise, I'm watching my diet, 26:23 and you know thank you very much. And when 26:27 we left, he says, you know, God bless you. 26:30 Is that right, well you know, I want to put that 26:31 list back up because I think this is worth to try 26:34 people may not have written it down, 26:35 but I definitely worth to try it, I mean as we 26:37 putting it up you know, just briefly comment 26:42 surgeries, if you just go that row you know, 26:44 you could have said, well you probably need 26:46 surgery, if you were like maybe some doctors 26:49 and not all of them are like that, but some 26:51 maybe would be saying, alright you need 26:52 surgery because that's, you know, would take the 26:55 pressure off and what not. How successful 26:58 are surgeries as a treatment for low back pain. 27:03 Certain types of problems with the back need 27:06 surgery, but there is a lot of excess surgery 27:09 done in our world, it's because the surgeon gets 27:14 paid by doing surgery not by telling patients about 27:18 a low fat vegetarian diet. And so there is 27:22 a lot of, you know, financial incentive to the 27:25 way our system works, pain is rewarded and 27:28 that's a whole another topic to get into, 27:30 but surgery often times you end up with the patient 27:34 that needs another surgery and another surgery. 27:36 Okay. And about 50% of time it does not work. 27:41 So, really this is not the best option, 27:43 the surgical option it is just is like catch up 27:46 work really if you go that way. We have been 27:48 talking with Dr. John Clark, really helpful information 27:52 for low back pain, we hope that you try it, 27:54 get that list go through it, we know that it 27:57 will help you have health that lasts for a lifetime. |
Revised 2014-12-17