Participants: Pr. David Klinedinst
Series Code: DPR
Program Code: DPR000019A
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00:07 Heavenly Father, Lord as we begin this
00:11 journey into what can be a difficult subject 00:15 for people, we are asking you to send us your light, 00:19 we are asking you to help us see the love of Jesus 00:23 on the cross Calvary. Help us to understand Lord why there 00:27 is a place called hell and what is its purpose 00:31 we ask that you open our eyes and ears 00:35 that you might write precious lesson on our hearts and minds tonight 00:39 this we pray in Jesus name amen. 00:43 Robert's father had a very bad 00:47 habit. Everytime Robert did something wrong 00:51 he would grab him by the neck, throw him on the 00:55 couch, and begin to lecture him and he would say son, 00:59 if you don't stop doing bad things, if you don't 01:04 stop committing these sins one day the all 01:07 mighty God is going to get a hold of you and when he does 01:11 he is going to burn you and roast you and toast you 01:15 in the ceaseless ages of eternity 01:20 of course little Robert would cower back in fear 01:24 at the thought of a God doing such a thing but as the years 01:28 went by this was the method of discipline his father used 01:32 over and over again. Eventually Robert became a young man 01:36 and he did things very embarassing to his father 01:40 and to his father church so again his dad grabed him by the neck 01:44 throw him do on the same couch and he now son I don't how to get 01:48 through to you I've told you over and over again 01:52 if you keep going these thing God is gonna get a hold of you 01:56 and when he does he going to burn you he going to roast you 02:00 and toast you through all the ceaseless ages of 02:04 eternity is that what you want? At that point 02:08 Robert couldn't take it. He had that shoved down his throat 02:12 all throughout his childhood so he jumped off the seat 02:16 and got in his fathers face and said dad let me tell you something 02:20 if that is the kind of God you serve, I want nothing to do 02:24 with him, I hate a god like that, I hate him 02:28 and he walked out the door that man 02:32 went on to college and university he had 02:36 an intelligent and keen mind and eventualy he became 02:40 one of the world's foremost athiest. His name 02:44 was Rober Ingersall a man who dedicated 02:48 his life to defying the existence of God through lectures 02:52 and writing of books largely influenced 02:56 by this doctrine of a forever burning 03:00 hell. The truth is many people use the idea of 03:04 hell to threaten unbelievers and get their children 03:08 to do what is right in fact there are churches today every 03:12 year who give all kinds of plays and dramatizations 03:16 that depict the suffering and 03:20 unutterable anguish of someone riding in the fires 03:24 of hell and then after they give a call to accept Jesus Christ 03:28 as your savior. But folks the truth is 03:32 that is a very poor line of reasoning to use with anyone 03:36 because it teaches people to serve God out of fear 03:40 instead of serving him out of love. To give your life to him 03:44 because you are afraid of somehting or want to avoid something 03:48 instead of looking at what Christ has done on cross of calvary 03:52 and responding to his love and to His mercy those are two different 03:56 things. One looks at God as loving character the other 04:00 looks at God as some sore of diabolical being 04:04 and see the reason this subject is important is hell 04:08 has become one of the most twisted, abused, and misused 04:12 doctrines in the entire christian church as a result 04:16 the character of God has been marred and 04:20 stained. So it is very important that we open up the Bible 04:24 and we let the Bible speak for itself not tainted 04:28 by the tradition of middle ages. So as we go into this 04:32 there is one question we have to answer to begin with. #1 What 04:36 kind of God do we serve, a loving God who wants to save us 04:40 or a cruel God who is eager to send us to hell which 04:44 one do you think. A loving God in fact 04:48 notice what it says in 2nd Peter chapter 3 verse 9 because 04:52 before we understand this subject we must know what is God's attitude 04:56 towards hell and the towards the wicked. 05:00 The Bible says, The Lord is not slack concerning 05:04 His promise, as some count slackness, but 05:08 is longsuffering toward us,(now what is a another word for longsuffering? 05:12 patient toward us) not willing that 05:16 any should perish but that all should come to repentance 05:20 Notice, the Bible tells us, God does not 05:24 want to see anyone lost or perish unnecessarily. 05:28 He is not eager to see people eternally 05:32 separated from Him. Can you say amen? In fact it says 05:36 He is eager that all should come to repentance. 05:40 Now not everyone will come to repentance we have a free choice. 05:44 But it is very clear God is not up in heaven, in partnership 05:48 with the devil looking down into the chasm of the earth saying 05:52 hey devil I got another one for ya have fun 05:56 with him. That is not the way God works. He is not looking 06:00 to keep us out of heaven he is not even looking to send us to hell 06:04 he is woring to save us so we need to understand 06:08 what God's attitude is first. Now to go even farther, 06:13 we also need to know how the word hell is used 06:17 in the Bible because this is important. Everytime you see 06:21 word hell in the Bible, it is not always talking 06:25 about the place of burning we think of. For example, 06:29 42 times in the Bible the english word hell is translated 06:33 from thw word sheol or hades which simply 06:37 means the grave 11 times it is 06:41 translated as gehenna which means 06:45 the place of burning we normally think of. And one time it refers 06:49 to a place of darkness,so if I see the word hell in the Bible 06:52 and in the context it is talking about the grave, 06:56 but I think its talking about the place of burning I'm going to come 07:00 to a misinterpretation so it is important to read the 07:04 context The verses before and after. 07:08 and it well be very clear whether it refers to grave or the 07:12 actual place of burning so for this subject 07:16 tonight there is really only three questions that 07:20 we need to be able to answer Question 1 when 07:24 hell-fire burn? Question 2 07:28 Where does hell-fire burn? And question 3 07:32 How long does hell-fire burn? If we can 07:36 answer those three questions, then we will have a very clear understanding 07:40 of this subject and I am happy to tell you, the Bible 07:44 answers all three of them in a very clear and 07:48 powerful way. Can you say amen? so lets start 07:52 with question 1. When does hellfire burn? Is it burning 07:56 right now, does it burn at the end of the world, or does it burn some 08:01 other time? So here what we are going, were are going to let Jesus 08:05 himself answer that first question becasue there is no one I trust 08:09 more than Jesus, amen? So take your Bible and I want you to 08:13 go to Matthew chapter 13 and 08:17 Jesus will clear this up with one simple parable 08:21 Matthew chapter 13 and verse 08:25 24 Now while you are looking this up 08:29 This is known as the parable of the taress 08:33 or simply weeds, those nasty thing tha now of us want in our garden 08:37 So here is what were are going to do, I'm going to sumerize the parable 08:41 Jesus told, and then in verses 36-42 08:45 Jesus will give word for word the interpretation of what it means. 08:49 so here is the story I'm going to sumerize it. Jesus 08:53 the story of is a farmer who has a field 08:57 and in his field he plants good seeds or good crops 09:01 but during the night an enemy sneaks in and plants 09:05 taress or weeds there and they grow up and start choking 09:09 the good crops. Well the servants of the farmer say to him 09:13 Sir did you not plant good seeds in your field? Then where did 09:17 these weeds come from and the farmer says, an 09:21 enemy has done this and the servants say 09:25 do you want us go into the field and to pull out of 09:29 hese taress these weeds? And the farmer the master 09:33 says dont do that because by doing so you'll trample upon 09:37 and destroy the good seed. Wait until the harvest 09:41 which is the end of the growing season at that time 09:45 we will separate the good seed from the bad seed and we will 09:49 bind the taress in bundles, and throw them into the 09:53 furnace of fire. That is the story that Jesus tells. 09:57 Later that same day the disciples come 10:01 and specifically ask him what does that 10:05 mean? Let's pick it up in verse 36 now, I'm going let read 10:09 Jesus interpretation. The Bible says 10:13 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, 10:17 and went into the house: and his disciples came unto Him saying 10:21 Explain to us the parable of the tares of the 10:25 field." Now litsen vesrse 37. He answered 10:30 and said to them: "He who sows the 10:34 good seed is (who?) the Son of Man. 10:38 The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the 10:42 kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. 10:46 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest 10:50 the harvest is the end of the (what?) age (or some version say 10:54 in of the world?) and the reapers are the angels. 10:58 now notice verse 40 it is very clear Therfore 11:02 as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, 11:06 so it will be at the end of this age. 11:10 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His 11:14 kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice 11:18 lawlessness, and will cast them into the furnace of fire 11:22 There will be wailing and gnashing 11:26 of teeth. Did you catch what Jesus just said? 11:30 He said just as at the end of growing season 11:34 during the harvest the farmer separates the good from the bad 11:38 and throws bad seed or the tares into the fire 11:42 Jesus says that is what it is going to be like at the end of the world 11:46 when the angles separate the good from the bad 11:50 and the wicked thrown into the furnace of fire where is 11:54 weeping and gnashing of teeth. So 11:58 let me ask you a question. According to what Jesus just said when 12:02 does hellfire burn at the end 12:06 of world that is not my opinion not 12:10 your apinion that is not a denomination interpretation 12:14 that is clearly what Jesus said. It burns at the end of 12:18 the age, which is the end of the world 12:22 now, just knowing that Jesus can clear that up and 12:26 in one simple story, let me ask you something, 12:30 do you think that we should find that in other places of the Bible too? 12:34 absolutely Lets go to somthing that Peter wrote, now I got this printed on the screen 12:38 In 2nd Peter chapter 2 verse 9 12:42 Notice what is says then the Lord knows 12:46 how to deliver the godly out of temptations and 12:50 to reserve the unjust under punishment (for when? 12:54 When is the time of judgment, day of judgment? that's the 12:58 end of the world. so Peter agrees with what Jesus 13:02 said that whould makes sense don't you think because ehrn Jesus told 13:06 that parable back in Mattew was Peter there? 13:10 He was, Peter was in the house he heard 13:14 Jesus explain it so it would makes sense that Peter would says the same thing 13:18 hellfire burns at the end of the world 13:22 so based on what the Bible says, 13:26 lets pose another question how many people 13:30 are burning in hell right now? 13:35 Absolutely none! See tradition 13:39 may say yes but I am not willing to look at Jesus 13:43 and tell Him that He is wrong or He doesn't know what He 13:47 alking about. You say where did this idea come from that 13:51 hellfire is burning right now? The truth 13:55 is it comes from the Middle Ages 13:59 it comes from the tradition and false doctrines of men that 14:03 have existed ever since the apostacy even during the time 14:07 of Rome. Now I what think through something here 14:11 What would it be like right now to think that people are burning in 14:15 hell, that maybe I have a loved one 14:19 who for wahtever reason chose not to follow the Lord 14:23 and I would think that right now they are burning 14:27 and screaming and writhing in all sorts of unutterable anguish 14:31 and yet I can still look at God as though 14:35 He is a God of love. 14:39 see even here on earth we have a court system 14:43 that says you must be tried before a judgement as to whether 14:47 innocent or guilty how can God send someone 14:51 to either heaven or hell before the time of Judgement at 14:55 at he end of the world when their life has been reviewed 14:59 if even earthly courts do what fair most of time, 15:03 would we not that the God universe of the will also 15:07 do what is fair. Can you say amen? I mean the idea 15:11 that if hellfire is burning now, that would 15:15 mean that Cain who murder one person is burning 15:19 thousands of years longer than someone today murdered 15:23 like fifty people a mass murder That's not fair 15:27 hellfire does not burn until the end 15:31 when people lives have been reveiwed. The truth is it comes from the middle ages 15:35 when a false doctrine was created 15:39 that said if you gave indulgence or enough money to the church you could 15:43 but the soul of your loved on out of purgatory and 15:47 rescue them and unfortunately that doctrine came into 15:51 christianity even into protestant churches and made it 15:55 way into the world in these morden centuries to where tradition 15:59 says hell is burning now but Jesus clearly says 16:03 it burns at the end of the world. 16:07 so we've answered that question pretty easily from the Bible. 16:11 But we got a second question. Where does hell 16:15 burn? Does it burn on this earth? Is it somewhere 16:19 own in core in the center? Does it burn on some other planet? 16:23 Where does this happen? So lets take our Bibles now 16:27 and we're going to go to the prophetic book of Revelation and Revelation can 16:31 answer this in one simple verse. Revelation 16:35 chapter 20 verse 9 infact 16:39 we have read this before in this seminar Revelation 16:43 chapter 20 and verse 9 This is describing 16:47 what happens at the end of the millenum as the Holy City 16:51 the New Jerusalem descends from God of heaven 16:55 Revelation 20 verse 9 16:59 The Bible says and they went up on 17:03 the breadth of the earth (this speaking of the wicked and satan) and they 17:07 surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city 17:11 and fire came down from God out of heaven 17:15 and (did what?) devoured them. 17:19 where is this seen taking place at? On the earth! 17:23 and when you think about it, where has sin been 17:27 for the last 6000 years? On this earth! 17:31 Where has been all the pain all the suffering and all the 17:35 heartache? Where has the entire great controversy between Chtist and 17:39 Satan been taking place? Right here 17:43 on this Planet. So clearly the Bible is telling us, 17:47 hellfire burns on this earth and I mean that makes sense becasue 17:51 if God is gonna create a new heaven and new earth, 17:55 hellfire is going to purify the old sinful earth so that God 17:59 make a new one. can you say amen? 18:03 in fact you known manytimes it you were to ask someone well 18:07 where is hell? The traditional repsonce is where if you had 18:11 point? If tradition was to point were is hell, which way would it point? 18:15 Down! but you notice in this verse 18:19 Where does hellfire come from? I come from up! 18:23 it is not down yonder, up yonder 18:27 it comes down from God out of heaven and destroys 18:31 Satan, destroy the wicked, destroy sin and 18:35 purifies this earth so rightness can dwell 18:39 again.See that is actually the good news about hell 18:43 I mean it is sad to think that there will be people 18:47 who will be destroyed people who will be 18:51 blotted out of existence and that is gonna break God's heart 18:55 but the good news is, hell is what ushers 18:59 in the perfect world again. Hell 19:03 is what ushers in a sence, the garden of Eden anew 19:07 Where God creates a new earth where is no more death there is 19:11 sorrow etc. Infact Peter writes about this 19:15 In 2nd Peter 3:7, notice something he said here 19:31 Now I got to pause on something there 19:35 Do you Know there is somthing in that verse in that 19:39 only our generation has been able to understand. 19:43 there is something in that verse that previous generations 19:47 have not been able to comprehend. You know what it is? 19:51 Think about this we understand 19:55 why the earth has to be destroyed 19:59 by fire but notice it says 20:03 the heavens and the earth 20:07 why the do the heavens have to be Destroyed? 20:11 Now understand,that is not capital H heaven talking about w 20:15 here God dwells. That it is talking about the firmament the atmosphere of the 20:19 above the earth. Why does God have to destroy that? 20:23 Previous generation did understand that. But I want you think about 20:27 something it is only been in our 20:31 lifetime lets say the last 100 years that 20:37 man has taken sin beyond this planet. 20:41 It has only been in the last 100 years that man walked 20:45 on the moon, that man has sent his Space Shuttle 20:49 and his Space Stations out into the atmosphere, that 20:53 man has placed hundred maybe even thousands of this 20:57 satellites up there in firmament up there in the atmosphere 21:01 and those are the satellites that beam down 21:05 all the filth, all the garbage, all the trash, that goes 21:09 into our TVs and into our computers into our 21:13 iPhone into any wireless device we have 21:17 it goes all the way up into the heavens and then bring all that stuff 21:21 down,in our homes, in our offices, maybe 21:25 sometimes eve in our churches. Things that destroy homes 21:29 that destroy marriages, that destroy family 21:33 and for that reason God also has 21:37 to destroy the heavens or the atmosphere that is above the earth 21:41 becasue man has taken sin there. 21:45 Now I believe God has put a limit on how far we can go 21:49 I don't believe that man ever going to able to live or be civilized on another planet 21:53 I don't belive that God is going to allow that because has already messed up 21:57 the firmament and the atmosphere in addition this 22:01 earth. But see the good news 22:05 is in verse 13, because then Peter reminds us 22:21 do you unterstands what that means? That means no more 22:25 will I have ever to read about a child being caught in the cross 22:29 fire of a drug deal gone wrong, no more 22:33 will I ever have read about some thug beating 22:37 a lady to get to get a few dollars out of her pocketbook to support 22:41 his drug habit, never more will I have to go to another 22:45 funeral. Can you say amen? Nevermore will have to see commercials 22:49 about millions of children straving to death 22:53 in Africa, nevermore will I have read about 22:57 about a terrorist flying a plane into a building somewhere 23:01 nevermore will have to read about mommy and daddy 23:05 screaming at each other and children and 23:09 spouses be abused. Why? Because the new earth is going to be 23:13 a place where righteousness dwells it is going to be the place 23:17 of perfection place where Jesus righteousness shines 23:21 brightly and where love rains supreme 23:25 and it is all possible becasue of what Jesus Christ has done 23:29 for you and me if you and I there in the New Earth is not going be 23:33 because of out good works, it's not going to be because we made very 23:37 choose perfected, when we are there it will be because Jesus 23:41 layed His life down on Calvery, that He was willing 23:45 carry His cross to Golgotha and He was willing to 23:49 give us His rightness so that you and I can be saved. The reason 23:53 that we victory over sin, the reason I can look forward to these 23:57 New Heaven and New earth, is only because of Jesus and 24:01 His victory over sin so tonight we ought to praise His 24:05 Name. One day sin will 24:09 be gone forever. 24:13 now in that quick span of time, we just answered the first two 24:17 questions when does hellfire burns, and where does 24:21 hellfire burns and the Bible has been very clear 24:25 But now comes the third question 24:29 How long does hellfire burn burn? 24:33 and this is the part where sometimes 24:37 we get tripped up. 24:41 The Bible does not say exactly how long hellfire 24:45 will burn, but you'll find that as we look up 24:49 a number of these verses we can confidently stand 24:53 up here tonight and make this statement 24:57 according to the Bible and the Bible alone, 25:01 hellfire definitely does not burn 25:06 through the ceaseless ages of eternity and God will 25:10 not torture people to no end. Yes there is a hell, 25:14 and yes God will use to rid of Satan, and sin, and 25:18 the wicked, but He is not going to torture people in agony 25:22 to no end, at some point it will go out. 25:26 You may think well Pastor Dave, 25:30 you realize what you said goes against the majority 25:34 of the religious world. Yes I do realize that. 25:38 but truth is you've figured out by now, I'm really not that interested 25:42 in what the majority thinks. And I'm really not interestd and neither are you 25:46 with the traditons of men come from the apostasy of the middle ages 25:50 the only thing we are concerned about is what does the Bible says 25:54 and what it says about the character of God. 25:58 so here is what we're going to do. We'll go through some 26:02 bible verses that usually we just read on the surface 26:06 and we miss the deeper meanings of then, before I go there I want to share 26:10 three logical reasons why hellfire must come 26:14 to an end. Let's just think that through, now not everything is answered 26:18 by logic but if we think this through it makes a lot of sense 26:22 according to the Bible. Reason #1 26:26 how many people are will say yes I believe there will be a 26:30 New Heaven and New Earth? Can I see your hand, I think almost everybody agrees 26:34 with that. Well if the Bible says God creates 26:38 new heavens and a new earth, how can 26:42 he do that if hellfire is burning on this earth 26:46 for eternity. Think about that. If the 26:50 Holy City descends from God out of heaven and comes down 26:54 to the new earth, where righteousness is supposed to dwell 26:58 how can that happen if this earth is going be one 27:02 ball of fire thorughout eternity and how could rigtoeusness dwell here 27:06 if hell lasts forever? That's very 27:10 simple and logical question see the fact that there will be a new earth 27:14 tells us thar hellfire must end 27:18 at some point. Infact to 27:22 illustrate this, let me ask you something 27:26 sometimes poeple have said well you know what is going happen 27:30 the new Jerusalem will be here on this earth and we will be able to look through 27:34 the gates of the city and somewhere over on the earth we'll be able to 27:38 see the wicked writhing in pain and burning 27:42 in hell and that will remind us that sin is coming to an end. 27:46 Folks I have to be very blatantly honest 27:50 I find nothing more sickening than that kind of 27:54 theology, because think about what that saying. 27:58 are we saying that I can be in the 28:02 Kingdom of Heaven that I going to look out 28:06 he gates of that city every day and 28:10 I'm going to watch people, maybe someone I know, 28:14 maybe a child, God forbid that didn't chose to follow Jesus 28:18 and I'm going to look out and I'm going to watch them scream 28:22 and writhe and cry out in pain and anguish 28:26 while God turns a deaf ear for all eternity 28:30 and then I'm going be able look at throne and say God 28:34 is love. Nothing blasphemes the 28:38 character of God more than 28:42 that. The fact that there is a new earth 28:46 tells us that one day hellfire is goign to go out. 28:50 Logical Reason #2 28:54 D we all agree that God is fair and just God? What do you think? 28:58 We all agree with that God is fair God is just, I think very denomination agrees 29:02 with that. Would it be fair and Just 29:06 for God to take a person who is a sinner 29:10 ets say 70-80 years of there life that the average life 29:14 today and for 70-80 years of sin and life, and 29:18 burn them for all of eternity? 29:22 Does that seem fair? In fact to help us 29:26 comprehend this let me give you a little analogy 29:30 as to how long eternity is. I want you to picture 29:34 a seagull, lets say we have a seagull here in Missouri 29:38 and we'll send that seagullall the way to the east coast 29:42 that seagull picks up one grain of sand, flies all the way 29:46 across the country to the west coast and drops that drops the grain od sand, 29:50 and then flies all the way back to the east coast 29:54 picks up another grain of sand and flies it all 29:58 all the way back to the west coast. How long do you think it will take 30:02 that seagull before he empties every grain of sand on the 30:06 and drops it off at west coast. How long do you think that would take? 30:10 A long time, do you realize 30:14 by the time the seagull accomplish that will 30:18 that will be only the first second of eternity. 30:22 Are we really willing to say 30:26 that God is going to burn and torture people 30:30 for millions and billions 30:34 and trillions and quadrillions 30:38 and quintillion and sectrillion and octillion 30:42 of years I don't know what comes after octillion 30:47 are we really willing to say that 30:51 the God who gave his life on Calvery. x 30:55 is the God who gave his about God's character 30:59 that would make Him look worse than hitler. 31:03 That would make Him look worse than devil himself 31:07 because then the devil's accusations would true, that Lucifer in 31:11 in heaven God is not fair God is not just God is not 31:15 love. Jesus Christ died on the cross and when to the grave 31:19 so that you I could be saved 31:23 Yes He'll get rid of sin through hell, 31:27 but he is not interested in torturing people. Now how many of you 31:31 let's think about this way, let's use a personal application how many of you have 31:35 ever burned yourself before in your life? Can I see your hands. Ok most 31:39 people, know how did that feel? It hurt, how much? 31:43 Alot! In fact when you bruned your self 31:47 depending how bad it was it does it stop hurting the minute you take 31:51 your hand out of the fire? Oh no that throb 31:55 in pain for days or weeks afterwards depending on how 31:59 severe it is, in fact you can do permannet damage 32:03 just have your hand in a fire or on a stove jest for couple 32:07 seconds. I remember when I was a kid growing up in 32:11 York, Pennsylvania I don't know if anybody York, Pennsylvania will ever watch videos 32:15 But in York Pennsylvania they make a huge deal about the 4th of 32:19 July you go down to the fair grounds 32:23 they have the symphony orchestra playing patriotic music 32:27 and you sit in the grand stand while fireworks or go off at the same time 32:31 it is really quite a show I use to love that as a kid 32:35 but you know on the 4th that we didn't go to the fair ground, 32:39 I grew up in the inner city 32:43 and just across the alley was a guy who go out and buy his own fireworks 32:47 buy his own fireworks and I'm talking about the big 32:51 stuff, stuff that probolly illegal he would get 32:55 M80's you know all this stuff that made a noise 32:59 shot things up in the air and I remember thinking, boy I want to go 33:03 see that, you know I'm kid and mother would always say to me, your not going 33:07 to go over in that guys that stuff is iilegal you say yard, she would never 33:11 let me go, so you know what I stuck doing? 33:15 what is the only thing that illegal? Sparklers! 33:19 so while all my friends watching the assume fireworks, I got to stayed 33:23 n my yard and do around a bunch a sparklers 33:27 I remember held that in my hand and I wasn't paying attention 33:31 that thing burned down all the way to my finder 33:35 I tell you might be just a sparklers but that hurt, I dropped 33:39 hat sparklers ran into the house and I put finder under cold 33:43 water for quit awhile and you know what even when I took my hand away from the water 33:47 that hurt like crazy 33:51 Am I really willing to say that God is going to 33:55 torture people in unutterable agony 33:59 just that way? Am I willing 34:03 to say that the God who give his life on the cross 34:07 will enjoy hearing the cries of the wicked 34:11 through out eternity? Folks if Jesus could be beaten and mocked 34:15 beaten and mocked and have his beard pulled out and be nailed to a 34:19 cross,and not destroy his persecutors 34:23 what makes us think that he will of suden change charter 34:27 and absolute enjoy torturing people. 34:31 Reason #3. The Bible says man 34:35 is not naturally immortal only those who believe in 34:39 Jesus are given Immortality at the resurrection so 34:43 it through. So if the wicked burn eternity, that means 34:47 they live for eternity, The only way you can burn forever 34:51 is if you live forever and nowhere in the Bible are the wicked 34:55 ever promised eternal life for eternity it 34:59 is only for those who are saved. Those are the 35:03 three logical reasons but lets go to something more powerful 35:07 than logic, amen? lets go to the bible. Now I have put some scripture 35:11 on the screen here, ones that you know very well. 35:15 Romans 6:23 is a very popular one. Notice wht it says: 35:19 For the wages of sin is 35:23 (waht?) death not eternal punishing 35:27 not torture death that a final state. 35:31 but the gift of of God is enternal 35:35 in Christ Jesus our Lord. So you see the two options 35:39 it is eternal life through Christ or 35:43 death the wages of sin is death. 35:47 Lets go to the most popular verse in the Bible. Which on do you think that is? 35:51 John 3:16 Infact I would like 35:55 read this on with me you can participate with me on this one, you ready 36:11 do you notice the two options there again 36:15 you either perish, that's a final state, 36:19 or you have everlasting life! That is 36:23 all it's ever been perishing or eternal life 36:27 Eeven in the old testamnet 36:31 notice what was hinted at in the book of Psalms. Psalm 37:20 36:35 The auther says:But the wicked 36:39 shall (what?) perish; And the enemies of the LORD, 36:43 Like the splendor of the meadows, shall (what?) vanish. 36:47 (The King James says consume) Into smoke they shall vanish away. 36:51 (or consume away) Not being eternally 36:55 punished or tortured, vanish, perish, consumed 36:59 that is a final state 37:03 but then comes the clearest text in all the Bible on 37:07 this subject we perhaps could have read this and gone home, 37:11 but I wanna give you more than that. I want to going your bibles to 37:15 Malachi chapter 4 Now we have not been here yet 37:19 in the seminar Malachi is very easy book to find 37:23 go to the book of Matthew go one book backward 37:27 you are in Malachi, the last book of which testment? 37:31 the Old Testment Malachi 4 37:35 and I'm to read verses 1-3 37:39 and then were are going to summarise what Malachi wrote 37:43 Malachi 4 and verse 1 The Bible says, 37:47 "For behold, the 37:51 day is coming, Burning like an oven, And 37:55 all the proud, yes, all who do wickedly will be 37:59 (what?) stubble. And the day which is coming shall burn 38:03 them up," Says the LORD of hosts, "That 38:07 will leave them neither root nor branch. Verse 2 38:11 But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness 38:15 shall arise With healing in His wings; And you shall 38:19 go out And grow fat like stall-fed calves. Verse 3 38:23 You shall trample the wicked, For they shall be 38:27 ashes under the soles of your feet On the day that I 38:31 do this," Says the LORD of hosts. 38:35 Now let's put a little summary here, this what Malachi just said 38:39 The wicked will be stubble, it will burn them 38:43 up. What will be left? neither root 38:47 nor branch. It says the turned to ashes, in other words 38:51 they will cease to exist. At some point 38:55 when live is snifted out of the wicked and they are turned to ashes 38:59 and nothing is left the fires of hell go out. 39:03 God is going to be just but also 39:07 merciful at the same time He is loving 39:11 but He is not interested in torturing He created 39:15 and vent people that He died for because He died 39:19 for the wicket to, it's just that they chose not 39:23 to accept the gift. 39:27 Wow that is so clear Pastor Dave. It is amazing 39:31 when you put all the versesof the Bible together, it is 39:35 unquestionable however, 39:39 there are just a couple of verses in the Bible 39:43 that seem to confuse and perplex people on this subject. 39:47 There are a few verses that almost seem to say the 39:51 opposite of what we have just studied here and so in order 39:55 to be fair we're gonna have to cover those topics too. Is that true? 40:00 It is not fair to just look at one side and not the other so 40:03 if I don't cover them, someone will put it in the question box anyway so lets 40:07 go ahead and ask the question, what about the phrase, 40:11 it is a biblical expression forever 40:15 and ever? Lets go to one of these perplexing text.. 40:19 Lets got to Revelation 20 aand verse 10 40:24 and we're gonna use this as an example of how to properly 40:28 study the Bible Revelation chapter 20 40:32 verse 10 vent thou this serious we're going to have 40:36 a little bit of fun with this verse Revelation 20 40:40 verse 10 now verse 9 has said that fire came down from 40:44 heaven and devoured them. Then cames verse 40:48 10 that all most seems contradictory because it says 40:52 he devil, who deceived them, was cast 40:56 into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast 41:00 and the false prophet are. And they will be 41:04 tormented day and night (how long?) 41:08 forever and ever. 41:12 That presents a wee bit of a problem does it not? 41:16 we can't ignore that the fact it does say forever 41:20 and very. Doesn't it? Not like I can take the eraser and erase 41:24 what the word of God said, if that 41:28 is what it means that means it has just contradicted 41:32 the rest of the Bible that means the Bible would 41:36 not be consistant and we couldn't trust its to be 41:40 inspiration now I'm not willing to say that are you? 41:44 there must be something about this frase 41:48 that we are not understanding, here is some things that you learn 41:52 contrary to popular belief 41:56 do you know that is the only verse int he entire 42:00 Bible that uses the phrase forever and ever 42:04 to describe hell did you know that. You can look from Genesis from 42:08 Revelation, that is the only verse in the Bible that uses that frase 42:12 in conjunction with hell fireand interestingly 42:16 enough it is in a book in the Bible 42:20 it is a symbolic a book that is not meant to be 42:24 taken literally. on top of that, 42:28 let me ask you a question, 42:32 do the meanings of words change over the centuries? yes or no 42:36 yes or no they do in fact let me give me you an example, and I'm not trying to be funny, 42:40 and I'm not trying to be funny, its just a good example. 42:44 If I were to read some literature back in the 1800s,lets say the seventeenth century 42:48 that literature was saying a certain person was gay 42:52 What would that mean? 42:56 they are jsut happy carefree and joyfull, but if 43:00 I were reading from literature in the 21st century today 43:04 and somone is describe as gay. Does that mean something different 43:08 it does it refers to different or alternate lifestyle 43:12 so if I am reading something from literature back in the 43:16 1800s like using the word gay but try to put today's 43:20 meaning into it. Am I going to misinterpreted somthing? 43:24 You better belive it, same thing here. If I try 43:28 to take our modern meaning for ever and put it into 43:32 the first century book of Revelation I'm going miss undersand something 43:36 becasue the truth is the term forever and ever is used very loosely 43:40 in the bible in fact here is a statistic that really helps to make 43:44 some thins clear if you got a concordance and looked up 43:48 the word forever you would find that over 50 times 43:52 in the Bible, the word forever is used 43:56 to describe things that have already 44:00 ended. Did you know that? Today we kind of use 44:04 the word and think it never has an end but the way the bible uses 44:08 the word it very loosely 50 times it refurs 44:12 to things that have actually ended. Infact let me show you one of those 44:16 verse in the Bible. It has nothing to with the subject of hell 44:20 but I want to show you how the word forever is used, this is back in 44:24 1st Samuel 1:22 And if you remember 44:28 when Hanna gave birth to Samuel 44:32 Hanna promised the Lord that if You give me a child I will decated him 44:36 to the Lord he will serve You in the temple. so now lets pick it up 44:40 here 1 Samuel 1:22 The bible says, 44:44 But Hannah did not go up,(that means to the temple) 44:48 for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the 44:52 child is weaned; then I will take him, that he may 44:56 appear before the LORD and remain there (how long?) forever." 45:00 in other words he is breast feeding and Hannah said 45:04 listen when he is done being weened I'll take him up to the temple, he work with 45:08 Eli and I'll fullfil my vow to the Lord and she said he 45:12 was goign to be with the Lord at the temple how long? For forever! 45:16 so if forever alwasy means through the 45:20 ceaseless ages of eternity then where should Samuel be right now? 45:24 He sould still be in that temple. Is he? 45:28 No Samuel is dead. What is the longest period of time 45:32 as long asthat Samuel can possibly serve the Lord in the temple? 45:36 As long as he lives and that is why He says 45:48 and when you understand how the Bible uses word forever 45:53 that many times it means as long as person shall lives 45:57 you take the Bible's interpretation. 46:01 Not mine, not some churches, not the middle ages 46:05 but the the Bible interpertation of forever put it back . 46:09 into Revelation 20:10 and it make perfect sense 46:13 It is simply saying the wicked will burn as long as they live 46:17 when life is snuffed out and they are turned ashes 46:21 and when they cease exist the fire will go out. 46:25 That is the proper way to study the Bible put the 46:29 textes together. Don't build a doctrine around one text 46:33 while ignoring 50 others that are crystal clear that is why we have so many 46:37 doctriens in the religious world in fact 46:41 did you know there are places in the Bible 46:45 where the word forever means an even shorter period of time 46:49 Let me show you one so this can be more clear 46:53 In Jonah we all know of Jonah being swallowed by the big fish 46:57 when he was in the belly of the fish he discribed that experence 47:01 in Johan in Jonah chatper 2 verse six he gets a little bit poetic 47:05 but notice what he says I went down to the 47:09 moorings of the mountains; The earth with its bars 47:13 was about me (how long?) forever 47:17 How long was Jonah in the belly of that fish? There days and Three 47:21 nights according to Johan 1:17 So here is an example 47:25 forever simply means three days. The Bible 47:29 uses the term very loosely and the truth is 47:33 so do we even in modern times. dont we? 47:37 I want you pretend when this meeting is over your going 47:41 home and you tell your husband listen I need some milk and egges for breakfast 47:45 tomorrow Lets stop at Walmart just a couple minutes so 47:49 he agrees, you drive by He see not need for space 47:53 because your only going to be in there five minute so parks by the door puts 47:57 the flasher on, you go into the store, you go right to the aisle you get the 48:02 milk and eggs and the eggs, you look for the short line and since it late at 48:06 night and is probably only aisle out open and your waiting and low and behold what 48:10 happen? The few people that are in frount of you somebody wants to writes 48:14 a check instead of using debit card and takes forever. someone has 48:18 like 25 coupons that have to be scanned, Oh and God forbid like 25 coupons 48:22 and someone pickups a product with no bar code on it, now you got to do a 48:26 price check and before it's all said and done its been 20 minutes its been 20 minutes 48:30 long. Your frustrated you get out to the car 48:34 your husband, his face red, bead of sweat are coming dowing 48:38 forehead what took you and he says took you so long? 48:42 and what are going say? Oh i had to wait in line how long? 48:46 forever. But how long did you really wait? 48:50 20 minutes. Even we use the term 48:54 loosely just like the Bible does. 48:58 One more perplexing text this one is in 49:02 Mark 9:43-44. The Words of Jesus. 49:06 Jesus said, If your hand 49:11 causes you to sin, (do what?) cut it off. 49:14 It is better for you to enter into life maimed, 49:18 rather than having two hands, to go to hell, 49:22 into the fire that shall never be quenched 49:26 of that is a little problem 49:30 Jesus just described hell as unquenchable fire. 49:34 fire that never can be quenched now what are we going do do with that 49:38 verse it seems to conterdict all the others, well 49:42 first of all we have to ask if Jesus speaking literally here 49:47 if we going to say yes then we have a problem with the first part verse 49:51 becasue I know no church that follows the first part of that verse literally 49:55 if your hand causes you to sin do what? 49:59 cut if off and somewhere else in the gospels I believe He says 50:03 if your eye causes you to sin do what? pluck it out do know any churches 50:07 got that as a doctrine you know sorry you did something bad with your hands 50:11 we are going to cut it off durning the worship service there be allot of people 50:15 handless and eyeless if that to taken literally. So that is the 50:19 first clue it is not meant to be literally. the other clue is this. 50:23 unquenchable fire we got two options here. 50:27 Eeither means that it will never go out and it will burn ceaselessly 50:31 which would contradict the rest of the Bible or 50:35 it means it cannot be put out by man 50:39 until its work is done, Becasue it is a judgement of God 50:43 which on of those do you think is the biblical one? Number 2 50:47 it is a judgement of God, it cant go out until 50:51 its work is done. How do we know that? because if you were to lookup 50:55 term unquenchable fire in a concordance once again 50:59 it would tell you the term unquenchable fire has 51:03 been used numerous times to describe things 51:07 that have ended I'll show you one example 51:11 from Holy Scripture, we don't have time to go through 14 of them Jeremiah 17:27 51:15 when Jerusalem was unfaithful, God uttered this prophecy 51:19 He said: 51:31 now this happened when ebuchadnezzar and Babylon conquered city 51:35 of Jeruslaem. Now if Jeruslaem was burned by unquenchable fire 51:39 and it I'm gonna conclude it means 51:43 burn throughout eternity . What should Jerusalem be doing right now? 51:47 I should be Burning.Is it? No if it was 51:51 it would certainly be on CNN it simply means that 51:55 it's a judgement of God, man will not be to stop it 51:59 until its work is done and when you put that definition 52:03 to hell it again makes perfect sense. It is God's 52:07 judgement on sin, man will not stop it but it will go 52:11 out when its work is done and the life of the wicked is snuffed away 52:15 and God creates the new heavens and earth 52:19 Satan, sin the wicked are gone 52:23 and sin will never rise again 52:28 See that is the Bible 52:32 truth about hell. 52:36 God is a merciful God he will be just, 52:40 but he isn't interested in torture people 52:44 you see friends the Bible 52:48 actually describes hell as God's strange act 52:52 it isn't something he wants to do necessarily 52:56 but Gog knows that He is going to get rid of sin, 53:00 the day will have to come when the fires of hell will be ignited 53:04 and I truly believe 53:08 that will be the wrost day of God existence because 53:12 that means He has to destroy people he loves 53:16 people He created 53:20 people He tried so hard to save. 53:24 People he had prepared a place for in 53:28 the Kingdom of Heaven but they were too busy to 53:32 hear his voice. I believe 53:36 there will be tears in the eyes of God that day 53:40 and even though we always think of God as comforting us, 53:44 on the day that heefile burns we may 53:48 have to comfort God it would be like 53:52 this, any of you ladies if you have ever 53:56 lost a child lost a child you know the appsolute 54:00 pain and anguish that causes 54:04 if I were to come to you as a Minister to try to conferred and minister to you 54:08 and came to you in your home and I said ma I know it hurts but 54:12 really don't I know lost one child but hey 54:16 you have three more don't weep for the one you lost What would say to me 54:20 What would say to me? Why you would slap 54:24 me in the face and youwould march me right of your house 54:28 because yes you may have 3 children left, 54:32 no one, no one will ever 54:36 be able take the place of the one you losted 54:40 there will forever be a void in your life 54:44 because that what a mother love is like 54:48 What do you think the Creator's love is like? Yes He may have many 54:52 who were saved, but there will always be a void in God's 54:55 heart for the children that 54:59 He did lose. Thats why God 55:03 works so hard to save you and I 55:07 we're so stubburn and we put other things before Him 55:11 tonight lets end with God's invitation, 55:15 John 3:16 where He says 55:31 friends wahtever stands between you and Jesus let it go 55:35 make decisions you need to make 55:39 now. Tonight are we willing to pray 55:43 the parayer and say Lord I want to be in the Kindom 55:47 of Heaven with you. Lord I want You to 55:51 save me. I want You to prepare a place 55:55 for me are we willing to pray 55:59 that prayer tonight? 56:03 I want to invite you to get out your response cards this evening 56:07 These are the ones that we use on most nights 56:11 write down the questions you have, write down if it made sense 56:15 but I want to asking somthing that is not on that card 56:19 if in your heart you would like to say Lord 56:23 I feel like I just want to would rededicate my life to you 56:27 I want to give myself to You Lord 56:31 I want invite you to write the word rededicate on the back of that card 56:35 and sometime durning this seminar maybe the last 56:39 night anyone who simply wants to rededicate their live to 56:43 Lord maybe we will all come up here as group and well just 56:47 have special prayer of dedication saying Lord I just want to give myself 56:51 to You al lover again, if that something that a 56:55 desire or conviction on your heart Just write me a little note on the back 56:59 card and say I would like too participate in a rededication 57:03 prayer and we'll make that part of this seminar before we end 57:07 a week from today. would you pray with me as we close 57:11 Heavenly Father, 57:15 thank You that we saw your love tonight even in this 57:19 subject but Lord we now ask for 57:23 you to give us the strength and power to follow you with all of our heart 57:27 with all of our soul and with all of our mind if there is anything 57:31 Lord if ther is anything that is keeping us from you show it to us Lord 57:35 help us let it go 57:39 now with every head bowed every eye closed 57:43 if you would simply like say Lord Jesus I want you to 57:47 save me and I want to be in the kindom with 57:51 You I want to invite you to raise your hand 57:55 all other heads are bowed my eyes are the 57:59 open right now you're lifting up your hand and saying Lord I want 58:04 You to save me , I desire to be in the Kingdom with You 58:08 Lord you see these hand that are raised 58:12 I pray Lord that bless them that would bless 58:16 their families give them the strength to do what right 58:20 and to put Jesus and your word first 58:24 we ask it in Christ name, amen |
Revised 2015-11-13