Celebrating Life in Recovery

Eating Disorders

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Jennifer Jill Schwirzer


Series Code: CLR

Program Code: CLR00091B

00:14 Welcome back, you were here with Jennifer's Schwirzer and
00:17 we are talking about her life and the things that happened
00:21 to her along the journey.
00:22 The reason we are talking about that is that we don't go
00:25 down with one event.
00:28 We really sometimes go all the way from our birth and get
00:32 hit with different things that eventually we take a fall.
00:35 I really believe there is a God, I really believe there
00:39 is a devil and I think strategically we are sometimes
00:42 studied, where are our weak areas?
00:45 Where can charges be set and when the devil takes us down
00:48 he takes us down easily with our natural leans in one
00:52 direction or another.
00:53 But what recovery does, it says let me strengthen those
00:57 areas in your life so you don't go down with those.
01:00 You look at them and deal with them and surrender them
01:04 and you learn from them.
01:05 You minister with your weak points, but it doesn't take
01:08 you down and that's why I think the most
01:10 incredible thing is.
01:11 If you're watching and thinking about your own stuff
01:14 good, you have to hang with us during this part of the
01:17 interview because this part is the good part.
01:18 Is Jennifer when we left on break we were talking about
01:22 all the different things that lead you to the point where
01:26 you are now finding in relationships in school what
01:30 you longed for your whole life.
01:33 So now you are doing drugs, you're in relationships,
01:36 you still are probably doing good in school
01:40 because you were bright, you are one of the brightest
01:42 women that I know is far as I have seen you study over
01:45 the years, I've seen you write some of the stuff you put
01:48 together is brilliant even in your own recovery.
01:50 So I know that probably even in that high school
01:53 academic realm you did well.
01:55 I've always been kind of a nerd.
01:58 I'm saying you're bright and you're saying you're a nerd.
02:00 What is wrong with that picture?
02:02 Well anyway, so yeah I'm in this relationship in high
02:06 school and everything went on for three years basically
02:09 and in the middle of it he broke up with me and my heart
02:12 is broken and I went into deep depression.
02:13 Then we ended up getting back together and I broke up
02:16 with him the second time, not in retaliation but just
02:19 because I actually lost interest in him which
02:21 I thought never would happen, that was toward
02:24 the end of high school.
02:25 Then I began my journey post-high school leaving my
02:27 parents home and going to college.
02:29 First-year college was experimenting with a lot of
02:33 different religions and I got deep into New Age religion
02:36 deep into their teachings. - what does that look like?
02:38 I had originally been introduced into eastern
02:43 religions through my back Doctor who told me to do yoga because
02:46 I have a curvature of the spine.
02:47 My back is never bothered me but he told me I needed to
02:49 do this so I could strengthen my back.
02:52 So I started reading on yoga and ended up meditating.
02:55 So I was like you said kind of a hippie, into meditation,
02:58 and then yoga and all this stuff.
03:00 I was experimenting with these New Age religions and
03:03 my first year of college, I was at a college that was an
03:06 alternative school where the nonconformists of the world
03:10 came and kids ended up studying whatever they wanted
03:13 to study pretty much.
03:14 There was a fairly strong witch and warlock contingency
03:18 at the school and there was a real strong lesbian
03:20 feminist movement so there was all these
03:22 really edgy people.
03:24 What people do not realize is that out of those
03:27 environments, a lot of people in those environments come
03:29 from their pain and their dysfunction but they study
03:32 things out, what philosophies were and what they
03:35 underlying thing was and I think we are seduced into
03:38 those kinds of things because of our junk.
03:41 Each of these religions has a philosophy or theology
03:43 behind them and it is for someone who likes to read
03:46 and likes to think, it is very attractive.
03:48 I was very disciplined and would get up every morning
03:51 and meditate, I was more disciplined about meditation
03:54 then I am now about prayer.
03:55 I would get up meditate in front of my Terrarium every
03:58 morning, and count on beads, but after a year of that I
04:01 realized I was still very lonely and so it was this gap between
04:06 how spiritual I thought I was, but then my basic heart needs
04:10 were not met. - what's interesting to me is when
04:13 I look at people and their recovery and myself in my
04:15 recovery is that a lot of fixes if they are not real they have
04:23 a grief reaction attached to them.
04:25 Because everything in the fix says that I found it and
04:29 this should meet all my needs, but when I am in my quiet
04:33 moment I am grieved because, am I not just doing it right?
04:37 It's like the philosophy that was being put across to me was
04:40 if you just do this long enough and hard enough you should
04:42 be fine and I was doing long, and I was doing it hard
04:45 and being really disciplined and I was still broken.
04:48 So that it became something wrong with me and it further
04:51 increased my sense of isolation you know.
04:53 What's really, I have a friend that is amazing, very
04:57 bright, very incredible and she is like you in that way.
05:01 She has this altar set up where she has a cool gong and
05:05 she hits it and it makes a certain noise and resonates and
05:10 then she goes into meditation or whatever.
05:12 She has all this stuff, even little idols that she has
05:16 the gods and all that stuff, but these are just made out
05:21 of wood so there is a point in her quiet time that she
05:25 knows that this is just a piece of wood and I am dying
05:29 inside and that's what I mean is that those things that
05:32 promise to fix us, mine was heroin which was much more
05:35 reliable than that piece of wood, because
05:38 I had a physical change right away.
05:40 It's like when we reach out to something that actually is
05:44 not real, it is not going to work, is that the grief that
05:48 happens on the underlying foundation, that is a deep
05:51 sadness, a deep grief.
05:53 I remember one evening going out and meditating by a pond.
05:56 I lived in the countryside of Michigan and was going to
05:59 the school and I lived in a farmhouse, anyway I went out
06:01 to meditate and listen to the crickets.
06:03 I sat by the pond and if you sit there long enough they
06:05 are going to start chirping again because they have gotten
06:08 used to you, the sound was overwhelming.
06:11 I thought if this doesn't help me reach nirvana or
06:14 whatever it was nothing will.
06:16 I got up and I remember getting up afterward and realized
06:19 I was no different and my heart was still empty.
06:22 I was walking home along this country road and I look up
06:24 into the sky and there was these beautiful stars, because
06:27 it's out of the country, it wasn't that I heard an audible
06:29 voice, but it was almost audible and said I forgive you.
06:32 And suddenly I knew there was a God.
06:34 Were you going to give me a high five?
06:35 - I was just saying Amen. Just praise God on that.
06:38 Because God says please look here because I'm real.
06:41 Then I ended up in a little Pentecostal Church that
06:43 I could walk to because I didn't have a car and it was
06:46 like within walking distance of this home in the country.
06:48 So I would walk there and they would be - Wahoo.
06:54 I'm a vegetarian right and I'm into reincarnation, or at
06:57 least I was, and this Pastor got up and he was obviously
07:00 not very healthy, he was very large and he said when
07:02 we all get to heaven were going to go out and have
07:04 a big thick juicy steak.
07:06 I was like what? I'm already a vegetarian.
07:09 So then I felt like he had to eat meat again if I was
07:10 going to be a Christian and I went home and tried to eat
07:12 some meat and I remember not liking it.
07:15 It is so funny when I hear people say I had to give up
07:17 meat, I wanted to be a vegetarian and be healthier so
07:20 I had to give up meat and I did the exact opposite.
07:24 So I became a Christian in the midst of all that and
07:27 started witnessing to my friends.
07:29 Was there a sense, because I'm following you on the last
07:33 segment and this segment and my heart breaks for this
07:36 child that is just like you want to fit in somewhere,
07:39 and I just want to be loved and to find that space.
07:42 When you became a Christian and when you were quiet with
07:45 God in your alone time what did it feel like to know you
07:47 really for a moment found that space?
07:50 If the peace that passes all understanding.
07:52 I felt Okay, I felt loved, I knew I was loved and I couldn't
07:58 keep it to myself.
07:59 I was in the midst of witches, warlocks and lesbians
08:03 and these people were not particularly opened to
08:07 Jesus saves and Jesus is the only one. - Stop! Shut up!
08:09 So I had people cursing me out and hanging up the phone
08:12 or people not even speaking to me, but amazingly a few of
08:15 my friends ended up tracking with me for awhile.
08:19 There was little community about 30 miles away that was
08:23 run by Seventh-day Adventist.
08:24 Seventh-day Adventist are vegetarians, some of them.
08:27 So I ended up going to their community and eating their free
08:31 vegetarian food, because they were handing out food and
08:34 it was really good for a college student.
08:35 So a couple of my friends and I ended up moving there.
08:39 Going from that environment of witches, warlocks and
08:44 lesbians feminist to straight laced, and this particular
08:49 ministry was really pretty fanatical in some respects.
08:53 In terms of how strict they were about certain things so
08:56 the women had to all wear really long dresses and the men
09:00 well it was very strict.
09:02 Very focused on the rules overall, but somehow in the
09:06 midst of that I cultivated my relationship with Jesus.
09:09 But there were other dynamics going on, like I remember
09:12 waking up every morning and feeling the sense of
09:14 condemnation. - oh, so you're back under pressure?
09:17 Yeah because the girls were so sweet and perfect.
09:20 Like Little House on the Prairie with her hair in a bun,
09:23 my hair's never been, it's got a will of
09:25 its own my whole life.
09:27 It's like feeling, like I was so crass compared to them.
09:30 I would accidentally say let's go to Sunday school and
09:34 little kids go, it's Sabbath school.
09:38 I would feel so inferior you know and I couldn't get a
09:44 grip - I just want to say God so forgive us.
09:47 So I felt like a misfit there but I found one thing that
09:50 I could do that would give me an edge and make me feel
09:54 like it was okay.
09:55 That was to basically starve myself, so I stopped eating
10:00 very much and became full-blown anorexic within a few
10:04 months of being there.
10:05 In that environment where people are trying to work their
10:08 way to heaven and they are using nutritional food and that
10:12 sounds like what you fell into, is that for you to
10:16 eat really well and looks good, they don't look at
10:20 I think she might be in trouble.
10:22 Well I figured if eating a Spartan diet is good then
10:26 eating even less is better and so I thought this is the way
10:29 to become more holy, and this is the way to get rid of this
10:32 gnawing sense of condemnation inside of me.
10:35 It sort of worked because when you don't eat well it
10:39 spaces you out and it really takes, it reduces who
10:43 you are as a person really.
10:44 Your brain doesn't work well as well and your emotions,
10:46 you don't do anything your body doesn't do anything that
10:49 isn't absolutely necessary for survival when you're
10:52 starving so there I was almost like a drug high,
10:55 because of low blood sugar and feeling really spiritual.
10:59 But it wasn't true spirituality.
11:00 So then what happened was people warned me and
11:04 they didn't like what I was doing to their credit,
11:06 as much as it was legalistic environment there were
11:09 people that were really caring and good people,
11:11 they were like you are on a bad track here.
11:13 My mother was very concerned and sent me to a couple of
11:18 therapists, one I just argued, he was a Christian,
11:20 I just argued doctrine with him the whole time.
11:23 The other one I went in, I remember him telling me he was
11:26 frightened of me because I don't know why, I weighed 95
11:29 pounds and it was like why are you afraid of me?
11:32 And that is what he left me with, so neither of those
11:34 really worked out.
11:35 Can I just ask you because there are a lot of people
11:38 watching, a lot of people I work with that have jumped
11:40 into bulimia or anorexia.
11:42 That slide into that, can you explain to us and those in
11:47 the café will kind of things goes through your mind to
11:53 rationalize that slide to make it okay?
11:55 Yeah, well it is another self fix like we were talking
11:59 about before, everything we do to try fix that sense of
12:02 condemnation we have ends up making it worse in the long run.
12:06 I just transferred from sex, drugs, and rock 'n roll to
12:09 an eating disorder once I became a Christian.
12:12 So I don't know if that was your question.
12:14 You know like in our minds - how do you rationalize it?
12:17 How do you rationalize it, what kind of thoughts go
12:20 through your head?
12:22 There were text, things that are read that seemed to
12:25 validate what I was doing and the fact that
12:29 I felt more spiritual it really did give me
12:32 a temporary sense of freedom.
12:34 A lot of people that are looking at these eating disorders
12:40 there is a time that it is health, actually seems to work.
12:45 There is that time that I'm getting all those toxins out
12:49 of my body and I am cleaning up and I am healthier and all
12:52 that stuff and then it goes into where my body is dying.
12:56 Well here's something really practical to be really
12:59 blunt, I had always had trouble with relationships when
13:02 I was a teenager and getting into relationships.
13:04 Now I had no sex drive, so the first thing that goes when
13:07 not eating is your sex drive, it goes out the window so it
13:10 was like great this is what I wanted.
13:12 I have control even here. - I have no more problems.
13:18 Even for folks that have been sexually abused, when that
13:23 goes for them eating disorders they feel safer.
13:26 So really the dynamics and the rationalization and the
13:30 things they get set up in your head, the negative
13:34 thinking goes all the way down to basic survival so
13:37 I don't have a thousand things that are tormenting me.
13:40 I have one thing. - that is so true of eating disorders
13:43 the simplifying, the way of simplifying life.
13:46 If I could just be this thin, and eat this much,
13:50 and weight this much then I am okay.
13:52 So it is a self reduction thing where you to reduce
13:55 yourself down to one simple thing.
13:58 It really cuts across how complex and really our potential
14:02 as human beings. - but for our torment, what a relief.
14:06 - it was a relief. - it feels like such a relief.
14:08 People try to make a really complicated during all that
14:13 time of setting this up is that it is not it gets more
14:17 complicated, it actually gets more simple.
14:19 It becomes all about one piece of food that I'm going
14:23 to eat, whatever it is you choose and I'm going to
14:26 choose that one thing.
14:28 For some people it is a bagel and a glass of orange juice
14:32 I'm going to eat that everyday.
14:33 I mean it gets real simple. - yeah, yeah.
14:35 So yeah here I am skin and bones and actually at my lowest
14:39 weight I was 85 pounds. - wow, how tall are you?
14:43 I'm 5'6" and I hover around 110 so I am a thin person and
14:47 that complicates the issue because I wrote a book on this,
14:51 I'm afraid people - Dying To Be Beautiful?
14:55 - yet dying to be beautiful and I'm afraid people will
14:58 look at me and assume I am still suffering but I actually
15:01 went on for about three years and then I haven't had any
15:03 dealings with its since and have no desire to go back.
15:06 I eat high calorie food whenever I get a chance, I just
15:09 happened to be the body type that is ectomorphic,
15:12 I just tend to be thin person.
15:15 Anyway in the midst of this I'm about 95 pounds and into
15:21 that place comes this man and he wants to court me, or to
15:28 date me and he has been through an eating disorder
15:30 himself. You know there's two kinds of anorexic one is
15:34 very related to fashion and people want to be thin and it
15:37 takes on a life of its own and they get emaciated.
15:40 Another one is spiritually focused and that was what
15:43 I was dealing with, I was trying to be holy not so much
15:45 thin but holy, it wasn't about fashion it was about being
15:48 spiritually fashionable - getting closer to God.
15:51 So he had been through some thing like that before he was
15:53 a Christian, he got involved in the eastern religious
15:55 cult, he almost died of starvation.
15:59 He was at this community type of thing and ate so little
16:04 that he ended up renting an apartment and collapsed on the
16:07 floor and couldn't eat it all, and couldn't get up and
16:11 a girl came and nursed him back to health with chicken broth
16:14 and he revived and lived through the experience
16:17 but he had been there.
16:18 So He saw me from a distance and he felt that God had called
16:21 him to, now this is an ideal situation, to date me
16:26 and like save me from this illness.
16:29 So we ended up courting and we courted for about six months
16:34 and after we got married I gained weight because for the
16:38 first time in my life I felt someone was there and
16:41 it was unconditional love.
16:44 What is really interesting and he saw me through all that
16:47 stuff, through all that junk is that for the first time,
16:50 because dad didn't see me, people at school didn't see me,
16:53 and finally somebody actually sees who I am.
16:55 Well and a lot of times when someone has an eating
16:57 disorder people gets so worried that they ride on the
17:00 person and they are constantly focusing on the eating
17:03 disorder and they reinforce that person's tendency to
17:06 over identify with their eating disorder.
17:09 So what Michael did was he saw me as a person.
17:12 He saw me as a whole person and I ended up becoming
17:14 the whole person that he saw me as.
17:17 Explain that a lot, or elaborate on that because for a
17:21 parent they are so afraid - I know they're terrified.
17:25 They're terrified because her child could die.
17:27 So the tendency is to focus on what they are eating or
17:30 what they are not eating and what they are doing or what
17:32 they're not doing instead of - weighting them all the
17:34 time - or trying to send them to different doctors and
17:37 all that can be good, but it can get to the place where
17:40 you are not addressing them as a person anymore.
17:43 I'm not seeing Joyce as Joyce, I'm seeing Joyce as
17:46 whatever problems she has.
17:47 I am reinforcing that tendency for her to think that,
17:51 that is all she is.
17:52 So when Michael saw me as a whole person he saw my
17:57 spirituality, he saw my potential, he was a bit older
18:02 than me so he was more mature but he saw me like a bud
18:06 about to bloom and when I saw myself through his eyes it
18:10 was very therapeutic and I think that is true of God.
18:14 He sees us as a finished product, if you take the word
18:18 in Christ and you Google it in the Bible you find every
18:22 verse that talks about in Christ or uses that phrase,
18:26 you will see that believers are literally scores of
18:30 things in Christ that they aren't right now.
18:32 But God sees us as complete in Christ because He knows
18:36 that eventually we will get there.
18:38 He now sees us that way Himself and when He looks at us He
18:41 sees this finished product and when we grab a hold of that
18:45 we can identify with who we will become and start to
18:48 become more like that.
18:49 So that is basically what happened in the context of
18:52 my relationship with my husband because he saw me as
18:54 a whole person, he was a tree planter.
18:57 So I had to cook over a fire and wash my clothes in the
19:01 creek - for a hippie that's good stuff.
19:06 I know it was perfect so I had to carry trees up, like he
19:08 would be on the mountain and doing tree planting and
19:10 I have to carry these seedlings up in a backpack
19:13 and mountains this steep so I had to be strong.
19:15 It forced me out of my skinny frail mode into someone
19:23 stronger and I started to idealize being strong.
19:28 Let me just ask you for people that have struggled with
19:32 eating disorders and an especially anorexia is being
19:35 able to say the journey coming back and learning to eat
19:39 again and all that, what was that like?
19:41 Because it is a journey.
19:43 It's true it is hard for me to eat and eat normally as
19:48 it is for someone who eats too much to eat less.
19:50 I know because your stomach is shrunk, you are not used
19:53 to handling that amount of food so I felt like I was
19:56 over eating. - you're talking about just a few bites?
20:00 It's not just the quantity of food, in fact anorexics
20:04 are great at getting a lot of volume and make
20:07 it look like they are eating a lot.
20:08 Oh look I'm eating tons but it's salad, carrots.
20:11 - tater tots? - no not tater tots it's stuff that
20:14 causes more to digest and more calories to digest than
20:17 you get from eating the food so it is stuff that is
20:20 super low in calories that's what anorexics do.
20:22 - even to me what is interesting about that disorder is
20:26 you are brilliant about food after a while - I know.
20:29 You know the calorie intake of everything.
20:32 Websites of people talking to each other about that stuff.
20:33 I used to study nutrition books and look at the calorie
20:36 content of everything so I would eat very low on the
20:38 calorie chain so to speak.
20:39 So but once I started eating regular food
20:42 I felt like I was indulging, it felt like overeating.
20:46 I had to walk over that feeling, I deal a lot with false
20:50 guilt in counseling. - talk about what that is for
20:54 somebody that doesn't know what all?
20:55 It's where you feel guilty about something
20:57 that isn't wrong.
20:58 In my case I felt guilty about eating normally thinking
21:02 that it was wrong. - and wrong on a deep level and
21:06 what somebody says they will look at you and say that's
21:09 ridiculous, everybody knows intellectually that it is
21:12 ridiculous, but I don't know.
21:14 But I was warped in my thinking so to me to be really
21:17 spiritual I had to eat this Spartan diet and if I would
21:19 eat more the man I would be losing my spirituality.
21:22 For somebody that's fashioned, if I eat anymore than that
21:25 I will never be pretty, I will never be.
21:29 So yeah I had to learn to walk over these feelings to say
21:32 this is normal and this is what I need to eat and I'm
21:36 going to eat it whether it feel guilty or not.
21:38 So I think a lot of believers fall into that false guilt
21:41 thing were I feel guilty, I must be guilty.
21:43 This must be wrong because I feel it is wrong.
21:46 What they need to do is to take that feeling and compare
21:49 with the Word of God and make sure that their balanced.
21:53 Now I want to say that Jennifer, that is the coolest thing
21:57 is that the Holy Spirit has a way of saying let's partner
22:01 up right now during this recovery time.
22:03 So how did God partner up? How did you confront your
22:07 lies with God, with your journey back spiritually.
22:11 Because spiritually everything gets trashed
22:14 when we get trashed.
22:15 I had to just admit I was wrong, I had to admit I was
22:19 fanatical which is really hard to do - ouch.
22:22 I had a go back and talk to the people who I had lied to
22:26 and said that I was fine when they knew I wasn't and I had
22:30 to say I was wrong and I had to tell people
22:33 I misrepresented Christianity to them.
22:36 I had a couple of friends, my boyfriend and a real close
22:39 girlfriend from high school came and visited me when I was
22:41 in the middle of the anorexia and they were looking at me
22:44 like what happened to you? I was this jolly person in
22:47 high school and here I am all skinny and real nervous.
22:50 I know it was a bad witness.
22:53 And your saying this is what God requires of me and I'm so
22:56 spiritual and they're like I don't want to be like that.
23:00 So I go and retrace my steps and tell people that was about
23:03 me and it wasn't about God.
23:05 - He didn't require this of me. - no He didn't require it.
23:08 In fact it broke His heart. - yeah exactly.
23:11 I had to go to my mom and say, it was hard to do but
23:13 I had to admit that she was right.
23:16 What did you say to her, because there are a lot of
23:19 parents dealing with this with their children?
23:22 I just said you were right, I'm sorry for what I put you
23:26 through, basically you did that out of love and I finally
23:29 recognized that this is more about me than it is about
23:32 God and I'm sorry I misrepresented my religion.
23:36 Then I started acting different- ly, I was so uptight when
23:41 I first became a Christian around my family because they
23:46 weren't where I was at and I couldn't do anything.
23:48 Now when I see my family I go as far as I can go without
23:52 actually bringing guilt upon myself, I'll just do
23:55 whatever they're doing within reason. - exactly.
23:57 Because no matter what, yours was food, but whether it's
24:02 a critical spirit, whether it's judgment, whether it's
24:06 anger, whether it is drugs, you know it could be anything.
24:10 You can have all these addictions that
24:11 we could hook on to.
24:13 Regardless of what it is we have to have that journey back.
24:16 We really do want to make amends to the people we love
24:21 as much as we can. Get some of those ends tied up.
24:26 Yeah, and like with my mom, all parents have a certain
24:29 amount of guilt, I know that now because I am a parent.
24:32 When your kids start having trouble you start blaming
24:35 yourself and so my mom was really broken by that
24:37 whole thing and it was really hard for her.
24:40 So I had to minister to that brokenness in her
24:42 and realize that she went through a lot.
24:45 It wasn't all about me, it was about her too, her
24:47 heart was broken when I was dealing with that.
24:49 Me being healthy was the nicest thing I can do for her.
24:53 Just laughing out loud and be more like my old self.
24:56 I love that because what you are saying that it isn't
25:00 really as simple as things got as you took it into your
25:03 addiction coming out keep it simple.
25:06 There is a thing of the 12 step program that says,
25:09 keep it simple stupid. I love that.
25:13 Some people would get really offended by that,
25:15 but we really do try to make it complicated.
25:18 When I can sit laugh out loud, when I can sit and enjoy
25:21 reconnecting with the people around me, without trying to
25:25 prove I'm this or that, I'm good enough or I'm not good enough,
25:28 or whatever when I can let all that go and let the Holy
25:32 Spirit just allow me to be in relationship, to be okay
25:35 in my own skin, that is the gift you give back
25:38 to the ones you love.
25:40 That's great, and now I notice when I'm around people who
25:42 have the same problem, I get really angry and I have to
25:45 take that to the Lord. Do you know what I mean?
25:47 - so explain what you mean.
25:48 Well when I am around people that is where I was at when
25:51 I was first going through this
25:53 - in denial, justify everything.
25:55 - trying the spiritual life - you're just jealous
25:57 because I'm skinny. - exactly, and when they are not
26:00 eating and I know they have a problem, I'm very inclined
26:03 to be hard on them and point it out and come down on them
26:06 because I was there and so I have to take that to the Lord
26:10 and be as gentle with them as my husband was with me.
26:13 So that is always challenging.
26:15 You know I can so relate to that, when I work with an
26:18 addict that just relapsed again I want to grab them by
26:21 the throat and God has to stop in and say I never grabbed
26:24 you by the throat.
26:25 I never did it's not who I am.
26:28 So it is that same kind of thing.
26:30 I want to just say I loved having you on the program,
26:33 I just loved having you on the program and I think your
26:37 journey is incredible and I know that we hit just one
26:39 area of your journey and there is a lot of different
26:42 areas we could have really focused on but thanks for
26:45 sharing this one and I would like you to stay with me
26:48 and actually come back for the close.
26:50 In the close there's a couple of things I want you to do.
26:54 I know people watching, there are people watching that had
26:58 these disorders that are locked in that.
27:00 They are starting to break denial but don't know
27:03 what to do and I want you to come back and talk
27:06 to them, is that okay? Sure absolutely!
27:08 Okay we are going to take a break and I have to say I am
27:12 proud of God, I just want to kiss Him on the face for how
27:15 He leads us in our journey.
27:16 Like how gentle He is with us in our crazy thinking.
27:20 We think that I'm just doing the right thing and what works
27:24 and we are starving to death, either emotionally,
27:26 spiritually, physically, we are close to death and God
27:29 says I'm still going to hang on to you.
27:31 I love you and I think that it's amazing.
27:34 We are going to come back, stay with us and think about
27:39 if you need anything from God just take it to Him,
27:42 just take it to Him.


Revised 2014-12-17