Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Jeremy & Heidi Summerlin
Series Code: CLR
Program Code: CLR00082B
00:15 Welcome back! So we've been talking about meth addiction,
00:19 well not even meth addiction, I hate when I say that
00:23 because most the time when I talk to someone who has an
00:26 addiction, there are all those hurts before that.
00:29 You are talking about your father leaving, and your mom
00:32 not really being there, she's raising all these kids.
00:37 Then the molest and going back to church, and having a
00:41 molest situation from the pastors wife.
00:43 So it's really tough to call it a molest because you were
00:46 16, right? - 15 or 16.
00:48 15 or 16, but it was, you call it a relationship every
00:52 time you talk about it, but we know you were
00:54 in a molest situation again and then jumping into the meth.
00:58 It's crazy, all that got crazier and crazier.
01:03 When did you guys finally meet? Like Heidi do you remember
01:07 walk into his life during this time?
01:09 Yeah I did, I was actually dating somebody that was living
01:13 with him at the time, and that is how I initially met him.
01:19 So I would go to their house and use, just to be with the
01:22 guys, I didn't really have an addiction to the meth
01:26 although that was part of it.
01:28 - your addiction was relationships? - Um Hummmm!
01:31 Controlling in trying to fix them.
01:36 Did you know that right away or was years later?
01:39 Yeah. - it is really interesting that if you find a
01:42 bad guy, you will find the girls that want to fix them.
01:45 It is just what our addictions are.
01:48 So when she started to come over, you guys using
01:52 together, tell me a little bit about what that was like
01:55 for you and that I want to find out where you came from.
01:59 Everybody has a history, and it amazes me when you look
02:03 at someone who is really into meth or into addictions,
02:06 and then when they get into a relationship usually that
02:10 person is a mess too.
02:12 It cracks me up because I think God is like oh no, no.
02:17 Then He steps in and has to untwist everybody, so where
02:22 did you come from?
02:24 My mom and dad divorced when I was about 10 or 11-ish.
02:28 I don't really remember much before that other than normal
02:33 family stuff, we didn't do a whole lot as a family.
02:36 My mom and dad started fighting before they divorced.
02:39 So even in your home what you saw as far as a loving
02:43 relationship was this chaos? - Um Hummmm!
02:45 Yeah, I don't remember a whole lot of my mom hugging me,
02:50 loving me, I was the oldest of four, I am the oldest of
02:54 four, but when my dad left, my mom immediately turned to
02:59 bars, and I didn't know at the time that she was getting
03:02 hooked on meth, she had been doing it for a while but it
03:05 became predominant around that time.
03:07 So I became, what somebody just titled it, a surrogate
03:12 parent, so I was taking care my siblings and not really
03:17 being. - trying to hold the household together.
03:19 Um Hummmm! Yeah, I was in sports in high school.
03:22 My mom, or dad moved out of state so I had no one there
03:27 supporting me, I don't remember my mom asking if I had
03:31 homework, or what you see a typical family is.
03:34 Let's sit down and do some homework, let's study,
03:36 there was none of that.
03:38 A lot of times we cooked our own meals and just taking care my
03:43 siblings. - was there a point where you got tired of
03:46 that? I'm tired of that don't want to be responsible,
03:50 or did you just do the right thing?
03:52 I just did the right thing.
03:53 What is funny is that 11 or 12 years old you don't think
03:56 of a child wanting a child, but I had always, even though
03:59 we didn't have God in our house, I would always pray to
04:02 God that He would leave baby on my doorstep.
04:04 I could take care somebody that would love me, unconditionally
04:10 I think it was. - because you were looking for that.
04:12 - Um Hummmm! - desperately looking for that.
04:14 Your mom got more tied up with her addictions, ay!
04:19 Yeah, we ended up moving into this house, a small one-
04:22 bedroom house and all four of us kids, there was two sets
04:25 of bunk beds in this house.
04:27 My mom had a trailer outback, that's where she did all
04:30 her activities and I just thought she had a lot of friends
04:33 coming in and out of the house because she ended up
04:35 dealing for while also.
04:40 The fact that she separated you guys out with having a
04:42 trailer out back, just tells me the level of her addiction.
04:45 This was not a tiny addiction, did she get crazy?
04:48 Because a lot of meth addicts get kind of.
04:50 That she went in waves, she come in all nice and happy
04:53 and fix everything, built fences, remodeled the bathroom,
04:56 put a roof on the house, I mean she could do it all.
04:59 That is when she was really high, then the coming down
05:01 part, she would come in and scream at us if we didn't
05:04 do the dishes, or something wasn't done,
05:06 she would come in screaming.
05:08 Were you able, during that time, you said you were in
05:13 sports, stay in school and all that?
05:15 I did until my junior year and then I moved out to Idaho.
05:20 This was in California so I moved to Idaho with my dad.
05:25 What's interesting in listening to your story is that
05:30 you were trained early on to fix things and take care of
05:35 people, so I'm thinking don't go to Idaho, because Jeremy.
05:44 You are trained, you are a kid that says if I can only
05:48 fix you than you would love me.
05:50 So when you ran into his friend and met Jeremy it was like
05:56 did you guys fall in love right away?
05:58 No, actually when I moved to Idaho, Jeremy and I didn't meet
06:03 for a few years, but when I first moved to Idaho I got
06:07 married within the first year and a half two years.
06:13 I had a couple abortions with this guy before we got
06:19 married, it's my oldest sons dad.
06:22 So I would like to ask you, even when you say a couple
06:27 abortions, how do you deal with that?
06:30 Or how did you deal with that then?
06:33 Back then it was like, it's what I have to do, I can't
06:37 have a kid right, now so that's what I've gotta to do.
06:40 - So you just detach yourself from the? Um Hummmm!
06:43 The second abortion was tougher.
06:45 The reason I'm curious about that is because when you said,
06:50 younger, your heart's cry was God leave a baby on the
06:54 doorstep, so for you to even make those decisions
06:58 had to be just tough.
07:00 Yeah, I had a taste of what it was like to take care of
07:03 kids because I had my siblings to take care of, so when
07:07 I got older it was like, well, I have to work and maintain
07:11 a home, pay rent and all this stuff.
07:13 So having a baby right now wasn't in the equation,
07:16 we couldn't do that, and he and I had talked about it so
07:19 it wasn't something we were ready for.
07:21 He was more not ready, then I was.
07:25 We are going to come back to that because I know that in
07:28 your recovery, you have probably gone back to this issue
07:31 again, so we will come back to that.
07:33 At this point, and for anyone listening, is that
07:37 in a societal thing the abortion is no big deal.
07:39 You just have it, you think about all the stuff,
07:42 can you afford it this child or not, and just walked in
07:46 and have it, and it is really not considered a big deal.
07:49 What is so sad about the first two, I actually had three.
07:52 The first two that I had were within six months of each
07:55 other, so was almost like a form of birth control for me.
07:58 Even though I would not walk up to someone and tell them
08:01 that I had done, there was no way I would tell anybody,
08:04 other than my immediate family, that I had done that.
08:07 As one of the girls that I ran with all the streets,
08:11 by the time she was 17 or 18 years old, she had seven
08:14 abortions, so when you say it is a form of birth control,
08:18 I saw that over and over again.
08:23 I think I was blessed in that I couldn't get pregnant,
08:26 couldn't have children, I don't know how I had Jackie my
08:29 daughter because it was like a miracle.
08:31 I was blessed in that sense of not having to deal with it.
08:34 A lot of my friends, you didn't think about it.
08:37 Even what you were saying Jeremy, you would say I'm going
08:41 to get high again and all the stuff of go away again.
08:45 So you have a couple abortions and ended up getting
08:51 married. - got married, had Eric and then his dad was
08:55 an alcoholic and, he passed away a couple of years ago.
08:59 He was an alcoholic, a pretty bad alcoholic.
09:02 He wasn't a bar drunk, he would drink on the way home
09:04 and then he would drink beer.
09:05 He was not angry, he wasn't mean to me.
09:08 If that drinking wasn't there we probably would have stayed
09:11 together for quite a while, we got along really well.
09:16 Then we moved to Montana for short time and he got into
09:19 a one vehicle accident and nearly killed himself with
09:23 his truck and at Junction Canal.
09:25 I had had enough and couldn't do it anymore.
09:28 I told him that we were going to split up, we moved back
09:32 to Idaho and we separated.
09:34 Just before we separated I had gotten pregnant again and
09:38 I said there was no way to take care of two babies by
09:42 myself so I went had another abortion after Eric and
09:45 then we separated, yeah, so.
09:49 So was it during that time that you are working in Idaho?
09:53 Did you get a job? - yeah, I just start working in a law
09:57 office at that time, I worked there for about a year and
10:01 then I start working a county prosecutor's office.
10:06 That's what I meant Jeremy, yeah.
10:10 I can't believe it, I can't put the two together.
10:13 That hurts my brain.
10:14 For you, all that trauma, were you using at that time?
10:23 Here and there, just parties or what ever.
10:26 It wasn't like I had to have it.
10:28 So yours was relationships again.
10:30 So now you are dating someone and you meet Jeremy.
10:35 How long before you guys get together?
10:39 It was probably three years, because he actually started
10:43 dating my sister first, so he was in a relationship with
10:46 my sister for two years.
10:48 Then he split up from her. - I had another gal and had a kid.
10:54 - then he broke up with her and was living in his car.
10:57 That so attractive, you're living in your car, and would
11:00 you come stay with me?
11:02 And I'm thinking, I can fix you.
11:04 That drive to fix someone is absolutely huge.
11:10 It's like I know that all you need is someone to love you,
11:14 all you need is that.
11:16 So he moves in with you and what was that like?
11:21 He is still using.
11:23 What is funny is that the night we actually got together
11:26 was when my second divorce was final.
11:29 So we were celebrating and went out and got high and
11:33 he came back to my place and we pretty much been together
11:37 of and on since then.
11:38 Your second divorce, did you have children in that
11:40 relationship? Um Hummmm! I did.
11:41 I had one of my first marriage, one with my second,
11:44 then a third one out of wedlock.
11:47 So three kids from three different dads.
11:50 When you say that, I know for you that was the hardest
11:54 thing to say out loud.
11:56 I wouldn't dare, especially working in a prosecutor's
11:59 office, I mean they arrested girls.
12:01 They would say oh yeah this woman's got six kids, and they
12:04 all have different dads, and I'm thinking oh my,
12:06 I'm not going to say word.
12:08 Because I do not want to be put in that class,
12:10 but I was right there with them.
12:12 The reason I think that's amazing that you can say that
12:17 here, on this program, I know that healing God has been done
12:20 in your life, and I'm so proud of God.
12:23 We don't deserve any of it, we are just going from place
12:27 to place and we are so wounded and God says I love you.
12:30 I love you and I am so sorry that you have acted out in the
12:34 way you have acted out, I'm sorry that you're wounded and
12:37 have been wounded in the way you've been wounded.
12:39 I just want to bring healing and help you to surrender
12:42 all that shame, but at this point you are not even there
12:45 at that point, you are now in a relationship with Jeremy.
12:49 I know you guys and it cracks me up, because I know that
12:52 you are wild, you were wild in your addiction.
12:55 You don't take care the people around you, and you are
12:58 wanting someone to take care of you and bring someone in
13:01 that just cannot do that yet.
13:03 So what was that relationship like for you guys?
13:06 It was crazy, I think within the first three months of
13:10 being together, there was this one time a drug deal went
13:14 down at our house, it was an apartment.
13:15 The kids weren't there, they were in school or something.
13:19 Anyway as drug deal went down and that night Jeremy is
13:22 like I had to do something, have to take care of business.
13:25 So he was going to different town.
13:28 I'm sitting there and all of a sudden I get a phone call
13:30 asking for Jeremy and I said he was not here.
13:32 She says, well I think you are lying I look in your windows
13:35 right now, I'm thinking oh my word, really!
13:38 She said you better not call the cops because if you do I'm
13:41 going to bust out the window, dah, dah, dah.
13:43 She goes you need to open the door so we can see that
13:45 Jeremy is not there.
13:47 So I look in the peephole and there is two girls there.
13:49 One has a hammer and the other has 2 x 4.
13:52 I'm thinking, I'm just freaking out, my kids are in bed
13:55 and Jeremy is gone so I open the door and said
13:58 please just be quiet.
13:59 My kids are sleeping and so the girls goes and walks
14:02 through the room and she's like,
14:04 Jeremy owes us a hundred bucks.
14:06 I'm thinking, a hundred bucks and you're ready to bash
14:10 heads in for a hundred bucks?
14:12 I said I have a $40, please would you take that and go?
14:16 I was just petrified, so she was saying be sure you tell
14:20 Jeremy he owes you 40 bucks, but we will be back.
14:22 They leave and come to find out he was shot at that night.
14:27 That was the beginning of our relationship,
14:30 it really was wildness.
14:33 And you're still saying, how can I help?
14:36 I know I can change this guy.
14:38 It's interesting, and Jeremy I want you to say this from
14:43 a perspective of, even at that there is nothing in you that
14:48 says, I need to change anything?
14:53 Not at that point. - I need to protect these children,
14:55 I need to protect Heidi?
14:56 I tried keeping it away from that, just to show the level
15:00 of addiction I was in, I tried to keep it away from that.
15:05 He would tell me all the time, he was very compliant.
15:09 When I say compliant, he will come home when I would be
15:12 screaming and yelling, where in the heck were you?
15:13 What were you thinking? He would just say I'm so sorry,
15:19 I'm so sorry it won't happen again.
15:20 I'm sorry, I'm so sorry.
15:22 During our recovery it's funny because, when we would argue,
15:27 he would actually be combative.
15:29 I was like you know I liked you better when you are using,
15:32 because you have an opinion now.
15:35 Back then he would say what ever, very manipulative with
15:40 his words and would tell me what I wanted to hear.
15:43 All the time. - if there is anything else you need to
15:46 tell me about the relationship just to paint a color of what
15:50 that was like, go ahead.
15:52 I want to know when did God get involved?
15:54 Because to me I almost feel oppressed, because it is so,
15:59 there is so much stuff when we start acting out, and
16:03 addicts act out and for people that are using or watching,
16:07 they know all the craziness that happens.
16:09 How did God break through? What was your response to that?
16:17 I don't know how long we had been together, but I spent
16:24 the rent on dope, so we didn't have the rent money and
16:30 we got evicted, and I don't remember if that was, if they
16:36 both happened one after the other, but we ended up staying
16:41 in a woman's battered shelter.
16:43 - it was a homeless shelter. - A homeless shelter.
16:49 I remember us going to see the Pastor of the church,
16:54 do you remember counseling with him?
16:57 I would ask about, because I knew he had gone to church,
17:01 so I started asking.
17:02 We'd been going together for about a year and I would ask
17:05 little questions here and there.
17:06 He said they went to church on Saturday, I'm like Saturday,
17:10 that's really bazaar, because I had never heard of it,
17:12 I didn't have God or church or anything in my life.
17:14 So there were questions about a year after we got together
17:18 of here and there. - he's ministering to you?
17:21 I love that, I think God has a sense of humor in that
17:27 way, all this tragedy and all of a sudden, the little it that
17:31 you got throughout your life you are giving to her.
17:33 So at a homeless shelter you start meeting the Pastor and
17:38 he starts counseling with you a little.
17:40 Yeah, because I was the victim, I was the one who
17:43 everybody thought, oh Heidi, he's so horrible to you,
17:45 why are you staying with him?
17:46 That was just boosting me and my co-dependency,
17:50 just making me beam, not really a happy beam.
17:53 Somebody is recognizing that I'm doing everything I can
17:57 I am the good guy.
17:59 I'm doing everything right, he's the one who is wrong.
18:01 It's all on him because of his addiction I am the way I am.
18:05 So we will go to church here in there and it wasn't real
18:08 regular because I had to dress up.
18:12 I didn't feel comfortable dressing up, and people would
18:15 ask you are you wearing a dress?
18:17 We were smokers then, so we had to hide that.
18:20 They couldn't smell like smoke or anything like that.
18:25 God was popping in and out, He was definitely working on
18:31 us both. - So you into, what was the breakthrough, because
18:37 there had to be a decision time that you decide that you
18:43 are not going to use, Jeremy?
18:45 We had moved to Boise and we were doing okay.
18:53 - He started going to school.
18:56 - yeah, I started going to school.
18:57 But then I didn't have my lover, right?
19:01 So I sought it out and it found me, the devil seeks.
19:06 It's everywhere, drugs are an addiction everywhere.
19:11 We can find it where ever we move.
19:14 So I got into a whole different era of drug use.
19:21 I want to call it a different generation, because
19:27 I started seeing more and more and more black.
19:33 It was just this aura of evil and it was coming out
19:39 of the wood works.
19:40 It really started scaring me and we would split up and
19:46 I was still going to school.
19:48 - Let me jump in and say, for people who do not know,
19:50 sometimes when you get into a place where people are using
19:54 a lot of drugs, it is evil.
19:57 People are doing things that are so twisted.
19:59 The behaviors that are acceptable are twisted and there
20:04 is a point where you walk in and think, I know a lot of
20:09 people do not believe in the devil but you can feel the
20:13 presence of even demons in the room.
20:15 I think there is a point in addiction that you walk in
20:20 and just say, man, this is scary.
20:22 Some people think it is a hallucination, some people think
20:30 that or some people think it has to be in their head.
20:32 But I have been in that place, and it is definitely not
20:35 in your head, it's like you think okay.
20:37 I think maybe God gives us to just say, you can
20:41 continue this but it will take your very mind.
20:44 You will lose your body, you will lose your relationships,
20:47 but lose your mind.
20:49 Yeah, this was when I was right in the middle of it and
20:57 I started reaching up and out and saying, God what a my going
21:01 to do, what am I going to do?
21:02 One night I just walked out in front of the stars and
21:05 dropped to my knees and said, I've had enough.
21:07 I can't do this anymore, I do not want any more of it,
21:12 and from that point on I left the next day the house,
21:16 I was staying at, the story is great.
21:20 I called Heidi that night, I believe it was.
21:25 I used to have to travel to go get Internet, free Internet
21:30 somebody's, they'd have their thing wide open.
21:33 So I would get free Internet so I could check my e-mail.
21:37 I got this weird, bazaar e- mail from a single Christian
21:42 website. - I can't be without somebody, I always have
21:46 to have somebody, so even though I was in love with Jeremy
21:50 I still wanted somebody who didn't have the baggage he had.
21:54 Even though that's what I needed, but didn't realize
21:56 that at the time.
21:58 So I register for this Christian website.
22:02 - so you guys were not together at that time? - no.
22:05 We broke up, we were separated for probably three or four
22:09 weeks or so I told him that if he got his stuff together
22:14 and prove to me that he could not be using
22:18 that he can come back.
22:21 Well, in the meantime I'm registering for this Christian
22:24 website. - because three weeks is a long time?
22:26 is a long time
22:28 He evidently gets a confirming e- mail, I don't know how he
22:33 got it because I was putting in my e-mail address, but he
22:38 got it. - God did the whole routing thing.
22:43 That's right, because all of a sudden you are confronted
22:45 with. - it's like my heart goes what's going on here.
22:48 So I call her, I'm like what is going on with this?
22:52 We talked about it and I moved back in.
22:57 It was from there on.
23:01 What is funny is that before he actually, I was going to
23:07 kick him out, told him I couldn't do it anymore.
23:09 That day, on the way there I am praying to God the whole
23:12 time, I said I cannot do this without You.
23:14 Because he will start to get upset saying, he doesn't want
23:16 to leave or he'll change or whatever, it's the same cycle
23:19 over and over and over again.
23:21 I can't do that cycle, so I'm praying the whole time I'm
23:25 driving there, God you gotta to get me through this,
23:29 you gotta get me through this.
23:30 He got me through it, I didn't have the emotions,
23:33 I said there is your stuff, there is the door,
23:35 I've got an appointment and I will see you later.
23:37 I left, I mean there was no way I could have done that
23:40 without God helping me.
23:42 - and you needed to know that she could be done. - yeah.
23:47 I broke down. - oh yeah, he got upset like I've never
23:51 seen him. - I cried pretty heavily and that is the
23:55 first time I've cried like that in along time.
23:58 My heart was breaking inside but God was giving me the
24:01 strength to follow through with that because that was
24:05 the platform for his step of getting to his knees.
24:09 You guys couldn't have survived physically, mentally,
24:12 spiritually with these drugs and with these crazy stuff.
24:17 So you half to make that step and say, God is bigger than
24:21 we are and I have to turn it over.
24:22 If you are really here You will get me through this.
24:24 Because there is no way I can do this.
24:26 I'm going to open it up for questions right now, but I
24:31 want to go through the whole recovery thing.
24:33 We don't have time to do this program so I want to have
24:36 you back, but I want to ask some questions and then have
24:39 you guys close with us.
24:41 How is that? - that's okay.
24:42 Okay Eli, I know you had a question.
24:44 We have a son that has an addiction problem too, and he is
24:49 we have been through all that craziness.
24:52 He is in prison now, so I would love for him to be sitting
24:57 where Jeremy is sitting today.
24:59 - telling his story. - telling his story.
25:02 You know I'm sure there are a lot of families watching
25:06 that would love that recovery story that you guys are
25:10 sharing. - well if it wasn't for God we wouldn't be here.
25:14 Honestly, we would still be on that cycle.
25:16 Thank you Eli. When God came in and got your attention
25:22 I know it doesn't happen instantaneously, but tell me
25:28 some things that He did, just to give you hope that He was going
25:31 to complete the work in you, that He was not going
25:34 to give up on you.
25:35 Putting the right people into our lives, played a big part.
25:40 Like you Cheri, - there was a time I remember coming to church
25:45 and you were high and I was grabbing you saying get into
25:48 the Pastor's room, what are you doing?
25:51 But I do believe God put a lot of people in your life that
25:55 loved you, I remember one time you said I have to be here,
25:59 this is my safe place and it told me that in your addiction
26:03 you have to be in the house of God.
26:05 You have to come to church, you have to connect with us,
26:07 you have to stay faithful in what you know.
26:10 There was one time that Jeremy had stayed out all night,
26:13 it was during our recovery time, he had stayed out all night
26:17 and he came home the next morning and God was telling me,
26:21 ask him if he needs something?
26:24 Ask him if he wants some coffee or need some breakfast.
26:26 Be nice, don't harp on him, don't rag.
26:30 So I did all that and I went to the car and I actually was
26:34 getting ready for church.
26:36 I get into the car, God told me I was holding him back.
26:41 I'm holding him back from his recovery.
26:43 It was like a slap in the face, it was a gentle slap,
26:47 but it was like wow, and then He played these videos back
26:51 in my head as to what I had been doing and how I have been
26:54 doing it. Not so much focusing on him but focusing on me,
26:58 what I had been doing in this relationship.
27:00 I didn't make him do the drugs, but I kept him from going out
27:06 of the home, I was so horrible, I was.
27:11 - for somebody that doesn't know what you just meant by
27:14 that, because you talking about your co-dependency stuff.
27:17 So really spell that out for someone who just has no idea.
27:21 What do you mean?
27:22 Because what I know, with relationship addictions,
27:30 is a lot of times they have to be sick in order for me to
27:34 get my needs met, so if they start getting well,
27:37 I then get insecure, I don't know how to function at what
27:41 God was trying to say to you in such
27:43 a gentle way, as Heidi,
27:45 you have to deal with this so he can get well.
27:48 For people that are co-dependent for people that my stuff
27:54 is so huge, but it is not anything that people can see.
27:58 I'm not doing math, I'm not doing this and I'm doing all
28:01 the right things, and I'm the one staying home, I'm doing
28:05 the dishes, everything looks good and God just says that
28:08 part of you has to heal because you're getting in My way.
28:12 We are still dealing with my co-dependency, I mean I say
28:16 this so cliché, but drugs you can get rid of.
28:19 Emotions, the way I have been, and how I function, it's hard to
28:23 change, yes you have to change that with being an
28:26 addict, with any addiction you change that,
28:28 but I didn't have a substance, I wasn't holding on
28:31 physically to something and so we are still working
28:34 through my codependency, still.
28:37 - God is faithful. - extremely! - what I love about
28:40 the fact that He comes into our lives and works.
28:44 Because Jeremy, you have a ton to get used to,
28:47 because you had to say goodbye to that lover.
28:49 We had someone on the show previously that talked about
28:54 writing a letter to meth and saying as a lover I need to
28:58 break up with you, I need to sever this relationship.
29:01 They said they cried during the whole time, as they were
29:04 writing their letter and saying they didn't realize the
29:07 whole time that I thought you loved me, I didn't realize
29:09 you were robbing me of everything.
29:12 So during that time with God being faithful with your
29:16 learning to stand up outside your addiction, how is that
29:19 for you? - it was tough and a long road.
29:23 I am still learning emotions, learning how to feel certain
29:28 things, because I didn't feel for so long.
29:33 The only thing I felt was anger and, yeah,
29:38 it was very difficult.
29:40 You know the hurt and the betrayal, all the things you've
29:44 stuffed up, what is horrible with cleaning up, is all that
29:48 stuff comes up at once.
29:49 Where most people throughout their lives deal with that as
29:52 they go, with addicts we stuff everything, so it bubbles up,
29:55 almost at one time.
29:57 It funnels to anger, it become anger, and to deal with those
30:03 issues, the pain, that was a long road.
30:10 - I want to go ahead and break, I want you to come back
30:14 as we close and think about this, because this is what
30:18 I want you to say to us when you come back.
30:20 How do you, on a daily basis maintain a relationship with
30:25 God and your sobriety, whether it is emotionally or drugs?
30:29 So we're going to go ahead and take a break, and I what you
30:33 to think about that too, because on a daily basis for a lot of
30:36 us we have to connect with God and allow Him to continue
30:40 to work in our lives because at any moment that addict can
30:44 jump up and say wait, what about me.
30:46 So we will be right back and hear how they do it.