Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Rich Kollenberg, Susan Kollenberg,
Series Code: CLR
Program Code: CLR000051A
00:10 Welcome to Celebrating Life in Recovery,
00:12 I'm Cheri your host.
00:13 How about a 3-time felon, is God bigger than that?
00:16 Come join us we will find out.
00:45 Welcome back!
00:46 We are going to do the program a little bit different
00:49 because I want introduce you to the guests right away
00:52 because they have so much to say.
00:53 Not only in their recovery, which I think is amazing,
00:56 but in this season we are looking at not only recovery
00:59 but what God does with us.
01:01 I want to start this segment out with Jeremiah.
01:04 Jeremiah, I don't know what, but I love him,
01:07 he's called like the weeping prophet.
01:09 And I'm thinking I don't know why love him because
01:11 usually love energy and people in great moods,
01:14 and Jeremiah the whole time was saying you guys deal
01:17 with your stuff because you're a mess.
01:19 And at that he went around told everybody that even when
01:22 somebody was saying no it's not so bad and you guys are
01:24 okay, he's like no, no, no, deal with your stuff.
01:27 I feel I like sometimes I say that to people a lot,
01:29 is deal with your stuff because you're a mess and
01:31 God really wants to bring you to recovery.
01:34 But in Jeremiah 18 there was a part where God says
01:36 to Jeremiah, and I love this, Jeremiah I want you go
01:39 to the Potters House, I want you to check something
01:41 out and I'm going to speak to you through this.
01:44 So Jeremiah is very obedient so he goes to
01:48 the Potters House.
01:49 This is my take on it when you read Jeremiah 18 it
01:51 may not be exactly this, but Jeremiah gets to Potters
01:54 house and he's watching the potter and he gets this
01:58 piece of clay and he unfolds it and puts it like, you know
02:02 potters ball it up and puts it on the wheel.
02:04 As the wheel turns they start forming the clay into
02:08 whatever vessel they are going to create with that.
02:12 Jeremiah is looking at this Potter, it's got be just
02:16 fascinating, all the sudden the Potters getting a
02:20 little anxious, and you can tell.
02:22 He's trying to mold some impurities out of this clay
02:25 and he's pushing on it moving it and doing all that
02:29 kind of stuff and all of a sudden realizes he can't
02:32 get this impurity out.
02:33 So he takes it down to the clay again and makes a
02:36 simpler vessel out of it.
02:37 I'm like shut up because I don't want to be as simple vessel.
02:42 I don't know if you hear me say that, I want to be
02:44 incredibly, spectacular, woman of God,
02:48 used in every single way.
02:49 And that only thing that stops God from be enabled
02:52 to do that is the fact that we do not allow Him to
02:55 work out of our lives the things the devil and our
02:58 circumstances have worked in.
02:59 And so when God puts you on the Potters wheel, don't
03:02 whine, it's a gift and as things come up to the
03:06 surface, just like it does when the Potter molds the clay,
03:09 things come up to the surface and the Potter
03:11 literally moves that junk out of the clay so He can
03:15 continue to work with the clay.
03:16 I'm telling you God's intention is for you to be
03:21 absolutely incredible.
03:23 I'm going to introduce you to our guests right now
03:25 and God did the same in you guy's life
03:27 Rich and Susan Kollenberg, right?... Rich: yes!
03:31 And I know that God has just blessed you, has had His
03:34 hand on you, so I want to say for one think you for
03:37 being on the program and they do so much for sharing
03:41 your testimony with us.
03:42 Rich: thank you for having us we are very
03:43 excited to be here.
03:45 Cheri: when I looked at you, because we usually dress
03:49 a little casual and I came in, in just T-shirt and a
03:52 skirt and some flip-flops and I looked it you guys
03:54 and I thought somebody didn't give you the message,
03:57 this is casual.
03:59 Rich: were coming to see Cheri Peters so we wanted
04:01 to look our very best.
04:03 What is really interesting to me is that out of most of the
04:07 testimonies that I get the privilege of bringing onto
04:12 the program, I relate to your guys as the most.
04:16 So we are just going to start.
04:17 So Rich can we start with you, where did you come from
04:20 and what got you at the edge.
04:26 Rich: you know I didn't wake up one morning and
04:29 decide what I want to be is an addict, no way.
04:33 I had a little bit of low esteem problem I think
04:37 when I was in high school and I strove to be the best
04:39 at everything and wanted everybody to like me.
04:42 Cheri: and you were the best.
04:44 Rich: I was the class valedictorian, I was the senior
04:48 class president, I had all the stripes and big
04:51 letters and all the stuff that a good kid does.
04:55 I was excepted to several colleges and had some
04:59 scholarships and stuff and I didn't really want
05:02 to go that route, I just didn't want do that.
05:05 The mistake was I did nothing, I said I'd been
05:09 studying and working hard, I'm going kick back and
05:12 just relax here for little bit.
05:14 I went to work for a Chevrolet dealership...
05:17 Cheri: let me jump in, so your family was lifting
05:20 you up as far as academics, kind of a normal family?
05:23 Rich: yeah it was a secular family we didn't have God
05:27 in the house and they supported me in everything I did.
05:30 I was very musically inclined so I was the head drummer
05:34 in the stage band, marching band the concert band, you name it,
05:38 it was just go for it, go for it, go for it!
05:40 So my whole life became this excel thing, push, push, push.
05:46 Which wasn't a bad thing I suppose but when you don't
05:50 have God in your life your motives are all skewed.
05:53 Cheri: Or self-esteem, if people don't really take
05:56 into account, if you're not feeling good about
05:59 yourself and you are realizing, do I have push like
06:01 this my whole life.
06:02 Rich: yeah and you know you're looking back on it now I
06:04 see what the problem was, but when your in that kind of
06:08 a life you are so caught up in pushing and pushing and
06:12 pushing and you don't realize that that's your problem.
06:16 Cheri: Exactly!
06:17 So I got out of school and did nothing, I went to work
06:20 for Chevrolet dealership and became a mechanic.
06:22 I started drinking and smoking with the boys.
06:25 When I was in high school I worked on the side
06:28 pouring concrete so after the mechanic thing I
06:31 started pouring concrete and got introduced to
06:34 cocaine when I was doing that, and I just kept
06:38 graduating, graduating, and graduating up to a
06:41 worse and worse state of existence.
06:43 The funny thing is as I look back on some of the
06:46 things like the first time I bought cocaine and
06:49 I had a gun held to my head.
06:51 Now you think that would wake a guy up, you know
06:54 this is not where you need to be, but the thrill
06:58 of the disobedience and the thrill I guess of
07:01 what I was doing.
07:03 Stepping out on the next fringe so to speak.
07:07 Cheri: I'm really out here now.
07:08 Rich: so maybe that outweighed the logic, I don't know
07:12 how it all shakes out.
07:13 It was very dumb of me to put myself in those types
07:17 of positions and the further out I got of course the
07:21 weirder the positions get, the weirder things get,
07:25 and the more dangerous they get and so you're
07:28 constantly living on the razors edge.
07:30 As you look back on it now, you say wow, how did I make it
07:32 through that, how did I make it through that.
07:34 You make it through that because God has His hand on
07:37 you, even though we rebel against Him,
07:40 He loves us so much.
07:41 I can look back and see how He kept me out of jail
07:45 and things like that and just took care of me even
07:48 though I was in total rebellion.
07:50 Because He had a plan for me and I don't
07:51 know what it was.
07:52 Cheri: exactly and I don't even know as you said God kept me
07:55 out of jail, I felt like the Holy Spirit saying no
07:57 I was trying to put him in jail.
08:01 Rich: that's very possible.
08:03 Cheri: Rich the very fact and it's amazing to me
08:06 when I look back on my own testimony, or someone
08:09 else's testimony, you can see God's hand all the way
08:11 through that and you think I don't know where we
08:14 got the idea that God somehow walks away from us
08:17 when we walk away from Him.
08:18 I think if He did we would all be dead,
08:21 we wouldn't survive it.
08:22 Rich: you know that poem "Foot Prints", we all refer
08:25 to it and everything but when you look back especially
08:28 if you are an addict and look back on your life.
08:30 Cheri: so tell the poem for people who don't know what
08:32 you're talking about.
08:33 Rich: well you know it's about the guy this crying out
08:36 to God and he says God you know I look back through my
08:39 life and You said you are always going to walk with me.
08:43 Then I look back on the sand and I only see one set
08:47 of footprints... Cheri: on my worst times.
08:49 Rich: on my worst times and where were you God.
08:51 He says, well that's when I carried you.
08:54 That's when I carried you, and that's what
08:57 He's done for us.
08:58 Cheri: you are out there using, not even realizing
09:00 how far out there you had gotten.
09:02 Rich: yeah I'm using and going through all of these
09:06 bizarre situations and they become normal.
09:10 They become normal life.
09:12 They become... Cheri: in fact normal life becomes bizarre!
09:15 Rich: exactly!... Cheri: I can't stand to be around
09:17 people that are just hanging out, just laughing.
09:20 just being with family how boring is that?
09:23 Rich: it's just a very miserable existence.
09:27 So I got involved in cocaine for about 10 years.
09:30 Cheri: when you say that, unless you have been there,
09:36 you just think, 10 years of your poor liver,
09:38 when you said that my liver dried up.
09:40 It shrank a little bit, do you know what I mean?
09:44 Rich: I remember laying in bed at night with my heart
09:47 pounding so hard like it was going to blow out of my
09:50 chest and I would make deals with God.
09:52 Even when I look back now, I had talked to Him...
09:55 Cheri: I You keep me alive tonight.
09:56 Rich: I will never do it again, just get me through
10:00 tonight and the heart is just blowing up.
10:02 The next morning I would feel so horrible, right?
10:06 And then the next afternoon just have a drink and the
10:11 next thing you know it was on again.
10:12 Cheri: and what about you folks, the people that love
10:15 you how were they handling this 10 years of addiction.
10:18 This is the interesting thing, in this whole period of
10:21 my addiction, which was about 24 years, towards the
10:24 end I lived about 20 minutes from my mother and father,
10:28 they had got split up, but between both of them I lived
10:31 about 20 minutes away from them.
10:33 I saw them twice a year, Thanksgiving and Christmas,
10:36 that was it.
10:38 Cheri: so you had to cut them off.
10:39 Yeah I just didn't want to deal with the fact that I knew I
10:43 was doing wrong things, I just wanted to with the fact
10:46 that they were going to have to talk to me about it.
10:48 I was just hiding from everything.
10:50 So my dad I would actually go by his house and hope he
10:53 wasn't there so I can leave him a note, put it there
10:57 and take off and think that's good for a couple months.
11:00 Cheri: right just to let them know I'm alive.
11:02 Just to let them know I'm alive and it frustrated them.
11:06 I'm going to ask you a question that I know some people
11:10 just hate for me to ask, but during that time,
11:12 that 10 years where you're slipping notes to your
11:15 father where they don't even know half the time
11:18 if you're dead or alive.
11:19 You're strung out with Coke and all the other stuff
11:23 that comes with that, can you explain what got tweaked
11:27 in your personality, because some people think it's I'm
11:30 just doing drugs not realizing there is a huge amount
11:33 of who we are, our character.
11:35 Rich: you know it's interesting because of course as
11:38 you look back and see all the decisions that you make
11:42 as you stepped out on the edge, as I stepped out on the
11:45 edge, and did something a little bit different.
11:48 I would all of a sudden give myself a stamp of
11:51 of approval now to do that behavior once I did it one time.
11:54 When you learned how to lie your head off.
11:56 Rich: exactly, you actually claim you didn't never lied,
11:59 you never lied you would make those claims.
12:02 Cheri: I'm honest.
12:03 Rich: I'm an honest guy and you would be offended, of course,
12:05 if someone called you a liar naturally.
12:07 Cheri: Somebody said, how do you know they're lying because
12:09 they open their mouth.
12:10 Rich: yeah exactly! Only your lips are moving.
12:12 And even in that lifestyle, everything becomes who you
12:16 can con and who you can manipulate and who you can lie.
12:20 The truth is weird in that lifestyle, it's unnatural.
12:24 Rich: exactly so you live in this fantasy world that
12:27 everything is okay, but you have given everything a
12:29 stamp of approval as you move out farther and farther
12:32 and farther, so it's okay in your mind,
12:34 but really at one point in time you knew it wasn't okay.
12:37 Cheri: sexually!
12:38 Rich: same thing, you just do everything perverted,
12:41 everything is perverted.
12:43 Cheri: you know to me, one time in my recovery,
12:46 I came upon a statement of Ellen White's,
12:49 where she talked about cultivated sins,
12:52 natural and cultivated sins.
12:55 And I thought I can't even tell you what I learned to
13:00 be drawn to in that lifestyle, so I am glad that that
13:04 was brought out so it is not just the drugs,
13:07 it's not just that you learn to lie and steal and you
13:12 learn to tweak your character and your mind so
13:14 where you are not the same person.
13:17 Rich: exactly, even your surroundings because after
13:20 I did cocaine I got into methamphetamine and did that
13:23 for about 10 years.
13:24 Cheri: so what's the difference between Coke and Meth
13:26 for the people that don't know, even in lifestyle?
13:30 Methamphetamine to me, well once I start smoking it,
13:34 to tell you the difference.
13:35 I can't really describe a difference in my response to
13:40 it because I knew when I first tried coke that was the
13:44 answer to all my problems.
13:45 I had gotten so far in it that it no longer did what
13:51 it needed to do.
13:52 So then when I tried smoking crank that became the
13:56 answer to all my problems.
13:57 That's all I was interested in was my drug choice was
14:00 more, it didn't really matter what it was, what ever it
14:03 was to get me where I needed to be, to self medicate,
14:07 to keep me away from reality.
14:09 Cheri: what is really interesting a lot of people will
14:11 go from Coke which is socially acceptable drugs, you are
14:14 still staying involved in sometimes social situations.
14:18 Meth and crank, you are off, you are psychotic, you can
14:21 get delusional, you're paranoid.
14:23 I mean it literally takes you out even being able to
14:26 step into a social realm, you're out of that.
14:28 Rich: yeah this is what happened.
14:29 I started getting more and more removed from society.
14:33 The whole time you are saying this is okay,
14:37 because the drug...
14:39 Cheri: this is what I want.
14:40 Rich: this is what I want, this is what I need.
14:41 People ask me why don't you ever quit and
14:43 I would say why?
14:44 I couldn't see how bad I was living, so now I'm
14:47 living in downtown Sacramento in a little one-room
14:51 shack with a dirt floor with the chemicals to cook
14:54 the methamphetamine buried underneath were I slept.
14:57 I don't want anybody to get to it.
14:58 Cheri: You don't want anybody to steal it.
14:59 Not thinking what if this blows up.
15:02 Rich: anything, you know logic is thrown out the
15:05 window just so that we can get into our bodies what
15:09 ever it is we need to have in there so we can escape.
15:13 Cheri: so in that when we followed you through that where
15:17 did you guys meet Susan?
15:19 Susan: we met after we both started doing
15:22 Cheri: so in that one-room shack was your home?
15:26 Susan: no we never, I don't know what was we were
15:30 a couple but we kept separate I think it was because
15:33 he was more of a loner, but we were great friends
15:36 and great partners because all we wanted to do is
15:38 to get and use drugs that was our goal in life.
15:41 Cheri: so where did you come from, because we heard
15:43 were he came from, a normal family and all
15:46 that kind of stuff?
15:47 Susan: as normal as it can be, I look back now and I
15:49 know that my mom and dad did the very best they could.
15:52 I was sexually molested when I was younger for many
15:54 years, and at the age of 10 I start smoking and drinking
15:59 because that is what covered up that big dark hole
16:02 I had inside of me.
16:04 Cheri: that shame, you're not normal.
16:06 Susan: Right, because I knew I would never be like any
16:07 other girl I had ever come in contact with.
16:10 I was dirty, I was not worthy to be loved and so
16:13 if I could just be someone other than who I was
16:16 then I was okay.
16:18 Cheri: don't you, to me my heart breaks when you hear
16:22 somebody say I decided that at 10?
16:25 And I want to say just one thing, probably the decision
16:28 wasn't at 10, but you had probably decided that years
16:31 before, the decision to use at 10,
16:33 the decision to escape was at 10. Susan: right!
16:36 Cheri: and it works!
16:38 Susan: it did for a time, it did so by the time I was in
16:42 eighth grade, well the time I was in sixth grade I had
16:45 started smoking pot.
16:46 By the time I was in eighth grade I started using
16:48 cocaine, sophomore in high school every other weekend by
16:51 the time I was a senior I was using it every day and
16:54 then I had my first arrest.
16:56 Cheri: as a senior in high school?
16:58 Susan: yes, just got out of high school.
17:00 Cheri: for drugs... Susan: correct!
17:01 I sold an ounce of cocaine to an uncover police officer.
17:06 Cheri: so as that unfolded you went from Coke, how did
17:11 Meth come into the picture?
17:13 Susan: the same thing I tried to do geographical
17:15 because I figured if I could just get away...
17:18 Cheri: So nobody knows what a geographical is.
17:20 It's funny you said that, because I mean an addict
17:23 is like oh yeah, okay go ahead, normal people are
17:26 not going to know what that means.
17:27 Susan: if I just move to someplace where nobody knew who
17:30 I was, if they didn't know I had just gotten arrested.
17:33 The town I grew up was a very small town and my father
17:36 had worked there, the family is very well known, if I
17:39 could just get away from my surroundings and the people.
17:42 It's the people I hang out with and there is a problem.
17:45 It's the cops that busted me, had they just left me
17:47 alone, to let me do what I wanted to do then everything
17:49 would have been okay.
17:50 So I moved to Hawaii for five and one half years, and the
17:54 very first person I met was a drug dealer.
17:56 Cheri: because for a lot of druggies is we don't
18:00 see anybody but dealers or people that are like us.
18:04 You can see the craziness or the chaos in their
18:07 life or in their eyes and were drawn to each other.
18:10 Until we literally choose recovery we are
18:13 drawn to one another.
18:14 Susan: I always wondered, you know I went through
18:18 physical abuse, to smoking, crack, cocaine and I went
18:22 to get help and I said, can you help me change this person,
18:25 I don't know why he is hitting me.
18:27 He said to me you know you are an addict and you
18:29 need help, and I said what are you talking about
18:32 you know I don't need that and I finally ended up
18:34 coming back to the states because I ran out everything
18:37 in Hawaii and came back.
18:39 A family member was doing crank and that's
18:41 how I started doing that.
18:43 Cheri: so you start using Meth...
18:45 Susan: starting using Meth for about 10 years and
18:49 I am a 3 time felon, so I'm in an out of jail.
18:53 Cheri: all drug charges - yeah!
18:55 The last time I was arrested my father was the Mayor
18:59 of the city I grew up in and it was the biggest bust
19:02 in that county and there were a lot of weapons there.
19:05 I had never held a gun before, but they charged me
19:08 with that so I have a bunch of enhancements and all
19:11 different kinds of things.
19:12 Cheri: another thing, people that are in a normal
19:15 background, is that it is part of the lifestyle.
19:18 I mean you are cooking Meth, you've got people in and out,
19:20 there's guns everywhere and it doesn't even bother you.
19:23 I remember at times having somebody so paranoid that
19:26 they would take a gun and go in the backyard and
19:29 decide they are going to watch because they knew
19:31 for sure the FBI was after us.
19:32 They would stay all night long in a crouched position
19:35 with a gun and wait for anybody to show up.
19:37 I'm think of the fact that most of us don't end up
19:41 killing somebody is miraculous, but at that time I
19:44 want you to explain cooking Meth, being in that
19:48 lifestyle what is that like?
19:50 Rich: the thing is...
19:52 Susan: well for me you cannot wake up in the morning
19:56 or go to sleep at night unless you have enough to wake
20:01 up and enough to go to sleep.
20:03 You have got to make sure, I mean we stay up till
20:05 3-4 in the morning waiting for someone to call us so
20:08 we can go and make sure that we had enough drugs
20:10 so we could wake up the next morning.
20:12 That's how bad it was.
20:14 Cheri: because if you didn't have them...
20:15 Susan: we couldn't function.
20:16 Rich: you couldn't function.
20:17 I would drive around, I had a work truck,
20:20 I was still pouring concrete.
20:21 Somehow I manage to continue some form of employment
20:25 and I could remember, I had all the chemicals in the
20:28 back of the truck and I was driving around working,
20:32 and if you get caught with that kind of stuff it's a
20:36 pretty bad situation.
20:40 Cheri: just for people, we're going to get into
20:43 this little bit more, next segment, but chemically
20:46 you have gotten yourself so tweaked that you really
20:49 are not feeling normal unless you can jack
20:52 up all those chemicals.
20:53 Rich: exactly, yeah!
20:55 Cheri: so you're making sure you had enough get up in the morning
20:58 Susan: had enough to get up in the morning.
21:00 Cheri: What is the longest that you ever stayed awake?
21:03 Susan: probably 2 weeks straight.
21:08 Cheri: frying literally stuffing yourself full of whatever drug
21:13 is in front of you. Susan and Rich: Right!
21:14 Susan: whatever drug because then you would cook it and
21:17 it probably really wasn't crank but you went ahead
21:19 and did it anyway, thinking it was.
21:21 Cheri: so you know, and to me, again, I don't think anyone,
21:27 unless you are there, understands the craziness that
21:30 a week of being awake, what two weeks of being
21:34 awake looks like, what your teeth look like, what your
21:38 skin looks like, what your brain looks like, how it
21:41 processes information, although things were so crazy.
21:45 Man, I'm thinking all this craziness, I'm serious,
21:49 my body hurts for you guys right now.
21:52 And so your living environment you guys meet
21:56 and decide to date.
21:57 Rich: if you call it dating, yeah one common goal
22:01 getting to use drugs, it didn't matter if we had to
22:03 drive from Sacramento to San Jose in the middle
22:06 of the night to get drugs or whatever
22:08 it took that was the goal.
22:10 Susan: and you asked a question from Rich earlier
22:13 you know what else goes along with the lifestyle.
22:16 That probably was the hardest, I did everything I had
22:20 to do in order to use drugs, no matter what it was.
22:23 Whether it was stealing, I put my parents
22:27 through a lot of stealing...
22:28 Cheri: taking everything they own.
22:29 Susan: everything... Cheri: pawned it!
22:30 Whatever I had to do with the opposite sex, hang out with
22:37 whoever I needed to hang out with.
22:39 Dressed a specific way to try to attract
22:41 just immoral things.
22:44 Cheri: that is a part of the lifestyle, and a very
22:48 natural part of the lifestyle, in fact if you were not
22:51 doing that you would actually stand out because it's
22:55 like what do you mean.
22:56 Of course you're going to play some one, of course
22:58 you're going to sexually get tweaked and the anger and the
23:03 rage is amazing to me in that lifestyle,
23:06 did you ever feel that?
23:08 Susan: no I don't think I was a real angry drug user.
23:13 Rich: no we did not have nice things to say about
23:18 people that is for sure.
23:20 Susan: but we hung around people who were really angry.
23:23 oh yeah...
23:25 Cheri: because they would put holes in walls.
23:26 Susan: oh yeah!
23:27 Cheri: and totally flipped out, I just remember the
23:30 rage and then again I don't think I was into that
23:33 too much but I can remember with Meth addicts the rage
23:35 was unbelievable, the anger that would all of a sudden
23:38 come up in the next statement would be and so what
23:41 are we going to do?
23:42 And I'm like, do realize you just killed that person,
23:45 I mean it's like it didn't matter, what are we going to do
23:48 later on tonight?
23:49 Rich: and the filth, the filth I would sleep for days
23:53 when I didn't have the drugs, with my shoes on.
23:56 I wouldn't shower for days and even if I was on the
24:00 drugs, I would go in the same clothes for days.
24:04 I don't how people put up with me...
24:06 Susan: and the diet, the non-diet, we didn't eat,
24:11 we didn't drink water, we were just a mess.
24:14 Cheri: if I were starving I would get Hostess
24:17 Twinkies and butter, and put butter on the Hostess
24:20 Twinkies and put them in the oven and that was like
24:22 a good meal to me.
24:23 Rich: yeah you know it reminds me of a story.
24:27 One time I was starving and I had just come down
24:31 off of crank.
24:32 I had gotten up in the morning and I was so hungry, I
24:37 hadn't eaten in probably a week and a half.
24:39 There was a lucky store right across the street...
24:42 Cheri: how about drinking fluids?
24:44 Rich: no you don't drink, you're so dry.
24:47 Cheri: I just want to get a picture for people
24:49 because you don't drink, you don't eat, your body
24:51 just, I can't even believe we survive it.
24:53 Rich: so I'm starving, I go down to my truck, it's an
24:59 old beat-up truck and it's got this change, you know you have
25:02 stashes where you have a little bit of change here and there.
25:05 I'm almost tearing the seat out of this truck to get
25:08 enough change to go over there so I can buy one of
25:13 them Stouffer's four cheese lasagna, and I eat one of
25:17 those about every 2 weeks.
25:19 So I get enough change to go down there and I walk
25:22 across the street and I go in and I walked past the
25:25 cigarettes and I start looking at the cigarettes.
25:28 I don't have any cigarettes either, and I look over
25:31 at the food and I buy the cigarettes.
25:34 Cheri: We are going to go ahead and take a break,
25:38 but sometimes when we meet people, and some of you
25:41 are in this place, were you think that
25:44 God even can't get here.
25:46 God can't even get through this, and I just want
25:49 to say not true.
25:51 And that is the most amazing thing, we can take
25:54 ourselves to such destructive places, and if you are
25:57 sitting out there smiling and you haven't gone through
26:00 Meth, sometimes destructive places for us that are
26:03 more normal, they just don't look as bad.
26:05 But they are as bad, they are infested with junk, somebody
26:09 that is a perfectionist, or a religious addiction
26:12 or something that is a spend-a-holic,
26:14 I'm telling you it's the same and God knows where
26:17 you're at and can bring you out.
26:18 So we are going to come back and find out what did God
26:20 do with these guys, oh man!
26:22 Stay with us will be right back!