Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Rich Kollenberg, Susan Kollenberg,
Series Code: CLR
Program Code: CLR000051A
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00:10 Welcome to Celebrating Life in Recovery,
00:12 I'm Cheri your host. 00:13 How about a 3-time felon, is God bigger than that? 00:16 Come join us we will find out. 00:45 Welcome back! 00:46 We are going to do the program a little bit different 00:49 because I want introduce you to the guests right away 00:52 because they have so much to say. 00:53 Not only in their recovery, which I think is amazing, 00:56 but in this season we are looking at not only recovery 00:59 but what God does with us. 01:01 I want to start this segment out with Jeremiah. 01:04 Jeremiah, I don't know what, but I love him, 01:07 he's called like the weeping prophet. 01:09 And I'm thinking I don't know why love him because 01:11 usually love energy and people in great moods, 01:14 and Jeremiah the whole time was saying you guys deal 01:17 with your stuff because you're a mess. 01:19 And at that he went around told everybody that even when 01:22 somebody was saying no it's not so bad and you guys are 01:24 okay, he's like no, no, no, deal with your stuff. 01:27 I feel I like sometimes I say that to people a lot, 01:29 is deal with your stuff because you're a mess and 01:31 God really wants to bring you to recovery. 01:34 But in Jeremiah 18 there was a part where God says 01:36 to Jeremiah, and I love this, Jeremiah I want you go 01:39 to the Potters House, I want you to check something 01:41 out and I'm going to speak to you through this. 01:44 So Jeremiah is very obedient so he goes to 01:48 the Potters House. 01:49 This is my take on it when you read Jeremiah 18 it 01:51 may not be exactly this, but Jeremiah gets to Potters 01:54 house and he's watching the potter and he gets this 01:58 piece of clay and he unfolds it and puts it like, you know 02:02 potters ball it up and puts it on the wheel. 02:04 As the wheel turns they start forming the clay into 02:08 whatever vessel they are going to create with that. 02:12 Jeremiah is looking at this Potter, it's got be just 02:16 fascinating, all the sudden the Potters getting a 02:20 little anxious, and you can tell. 02:22 He's trying to mold some impurities out of this clay 02:25 and he's pushing on it moving it and doing all that 02:29 kind of stuff and all of a sudden realizes he can't 02:32 get this impurity out. 02:33 So he takes it down to the clay again and makes a 02:36 simpler vessel out of it. 02:37 I'm like shut up because I don't want to be as simple vessel. 02:42 I don't know if you hear me say that, I want to be 02:44 incredibly, spectacular, woman of God, 02:48 used in every single way. 02:49 And that only thing that stops God from be enabled 02:52 to do that is the fact that we do not allow Him to 02:55 work out of our lives the things the devil and our 02:58 circumstances have worked in. 02:59 And so when God puts you on the Potters wheel, don't 03:02 whine, it's a gift and as things come up to the 03:06 surface, just like it does when the Potter molds the clay, 03:09 things come up to the surface and the Potter 03:11 literally moves that junk out of the clay so He can 03:15 continue to work with the clay. 03:16 I'm telling you God's intention is for you to be 03:21 absolutely incredible. 03:23 I'm going to introduce you to our guests right now 03:25 and God did the same in you guy's life 03:27 Rich and Susan Kollenberg, right?... Rich: yes! 03:31 And I know that God has just blessed you, has had His 03:34 hand on you, so I want to say for one think you for 03:37 being on the program and they do so much for sharing 03:41 your testimony with us. 03:42 Rich: thank you for having us we are very 03:43 excited to be here. 03:45 Cheri: when I looked at you, because we usually dress 03:49 a little casual and I came in, in just T-shirt and a 03:52 skirt and some flip-flops and I looked it you guys 03:54 and I thought somebody didn't give you the message, 03:57 this is casual. 03:59 Rich: were coming to see Cheri Peters so we wanted 04:01 to look our very best. 04:03 What is really interesting to me is that out of most of the 04:07 testimonies that I get the privilege of bringing onto 04:12 the program, I relate to your guys as the most. 04:16 So we are just going to start. 04:17 So Rich can we start with you, where did you come from 04:20 and what got you at the edge. 04:26 Rich: you know I didn't wake up one morning and 04:29 decide what I want to be is an addict, no way. 04:33 I had a little bit of low esteem problem I think 04:37 when I was in high school and I strove to be the best 04:39 at everything and wanted everybody to like me. 04:42 Cheri: and you were the best. 04:44 Rich: I was the class valedictorian, I was the senior 04:48 class president, I had all the stripes and big 04:51 letters and all the stuff that a good kid does. 04:55 I was excepted to several colleges and had some 04:59 scholarships and stuff and I didn't really want 05:02 to go that route, I just didn't want do that. 05:05 The mistake was I did nothing, I said I'd been 05:09 studying and working hard, I'm going kick back and 05:12 just relax here for little bit. 05:14 I went to work for a Chevrolet dealership... 05:17 Cheri: let me jump in, so your family was lifting 05:20 you up as far as academics, kind of a normal family? 05:23 Rich: yeah it was a secular family we didn't have God 05:27 in the house and they supported me in everything I did. 05:30 I was very musically inclined so I was the head drummer 05:34 in the stage band, marching band the concert band, you name it, 05:38 it was just go for it, go for it, go for it! 05:40 So my whole life became this excel thing, push, push, push. 05:46 Which wasn't a bad thing I suppose but when you don't 05:50 have God in your life your motives are all skewed. 05:53 Cheri: Or self-esteem, if people don't really take 05:56 into account, if you're not feeling good about 05:59 yourself and you are realizing, do I have push like 06:01 this my whole life. 06:02 Rich: yeah and you know you're looking back on it now I 06:04 see what the problem was, but when your in that kind of 06:08 a life you are so caught up in pushing and pushing and 06:12 pushing and you don't realize that that's your problem. 06:16 Cheri: Exactly! 06:17 So I got out of school and did nothing, I went to work 06:20 for Chevrolet dealership and became a mechanic. 06:22 I started drinking and smoking with the boys. 06:25 When I was in high school I worked on the side 06:28 pouring concrete so after the mechanic thing I 06:31 started pouring concrete and got introduced to 06:34 cocaine when I was doing that, and I just kept 06:38 graduating, graduating, and graduating up to a 06:41 worse and worse state of existence. 06:43 The funny thing is as I look back on some of the 06:46 things like the first time I bought cocaine and 06:49 I had a gun held to my head. 06:51 Now you think that would wake a guy up, you know 06:54 this is not where you need to be, but the thrill 06:58 of the disobedience and the thrill I guess of 07:01 what I was doing. 07:03 Stepping out on the next fringe so to speak. 07:07 Cheri: I'm really out here now. 07:08 Rich: so maybe that outweighed the logic, I don't know 07:12 how it all shakes out. 07:13 It was very dumb of me to put myself in those types 07:17 of positions and the further out I got of course the 07:21 weirder the positions get, the weirder things get, 07:25 and the more dangerous they get and so you're 07:28 constantly living on the razors edge. 07:30 As you look back on it now, you say wow, how did I make it 07:32 through that, how did I make it through that. 07:34 You make it through that because God has His hand on 07:37 you, even though we rebel against Him, 07:40 He loves us so much. 07:41 I can look back and see how He kept me out of jail 07:45 and things like that and just took care of me even 07:48 though I was in total rebellion. 07:50 Because He had a plan for me and I don't 07:51 know what it was. 07:52 Cheri: exactly and I don't even know as you said God kept me 07:55 out of jail, I felt like the Holy Spirit saying no 07:57 I was trying to put him in jail. 08:01 Rich: that's very possible. 08:03 Cheri: Rich the very fact and it's amazing to me 08:06 when I look back on my own testimony, or someone 08:09 else's testimony, you can see God's hand all the way 08:11 through that and you think I don't know where we 08:14 got the idea that God somehow walks away from us 08:17 when we walk away from Him. 08:18 I think if He did we would all be dead, 08:21 we wouldn't survive it. 08:22 Rich: you know that poem "Foot Prints", we all refer 08:25 to it and everything but when you look back especially 08:28 if you are an addict and look back on your life. 08:30 Cheri: so tell the poem for people who don't know what 08:32 you're talking about. 08:33 Rich: well you know it's about the guy this crying out 08:36 to God and he says God you know I look back through my 08:39 life and You said you are always going to walk with me. 08:43 Then I look back on the sand and I only see one set 08:47 of footprints... Cheri: on my worst times. 08:49 Rich: on my worst times and where were you God. 08:51 He says, well that's when I carried you. 08:54 That's when I carried you, and that's what 08:57 He's done for us. 08:58 Cheri: you are out there using, not even realizing 09:00 how far out there you had gotten. 09:02 Rich: yeah I'm using and going through all of these 09:06 bizarre situations and they become normal. 09:10 They become normal life. 09:12 They become... Cheri: in fact normal life becomes bizarre! 09:15 Rich: exactly!... Cheri: I can't stand to be around 09:17 people that are just hanging out, just laughing. 09:20 just being with family how boring is that? 09:23 Rich: it's just a very miserable existence. 09:27 So I got involved in cocaine for about 10 years. 09:30 Cheri: when you say that, unless you have been there, 09:36 you just think, 10 years of your poor liver, 09:38 when you said that my liver dried up. 09:40 It shrank a little bit, do you know what I mean? 09:44 Rich: I remember laying in bed at night with my heart 09:47 pounding so hard like it was going to blow out of my 09:50 chest and I would make deals with God. 09:52 Even when I look back now, I had talked to Him... 09:55 Cheri: I You keep me alive tonight. 09:56 Rich: I will never do it again, just get me through 10:00 tonight and the heart is just blowing up. 10:02 The next morning I would feel so horrible, right? 10:06 And then the next afternoon just have a drink and the 10:11 next thing you know it was on again. 10:12 Cheri: and what about you folks, the people that love 10:15 you how were they handling this 10 years of addiction. 10:18 This is the interesting thing, in this whole period of 10:21 my addiction, which was about 24 years, towards the 10:24 end I lived about 20 minutes from my mother and father, 10:28 they had got split up, but between both of them I lived 10:31 about 20 minutes away from them. 10:33 I saw them twice a year, Thanksgiving and Christmas, 10:36 that was it. 10:38 Cheri: so you had to cut them off. 10:39 Yeah I just didn't want to deal with the fact that I knew I 10:43 was doing wrong things, I just wanted to with the fact 10:46 that they were going to have to talk to me about it. 10:48 I was just hiding from everything. 10:50 So my dad I would actually go by his house and hope he 10:53 wasn't there so I can leave him a note, put it there 10:57 and take off and think that's good for a couple months. 11:00 Cheri: right just to let them know I'm alive. 11:02 Just to let them know I'm alive and it frustrated them. 11:06 I'm going to ask you a question that I know some people 11:10 just hate for me to ask, but during that time, 11:12 that 10 years where you're slipping notes to your 11:15 father where they don't even know half the time 11:18 if you're dead or alive. 11:19 You're strung out with Coke and all the other stuff 11:23 that comes with that, can you explain what got tweaked 11:27 in your personality, because some people think it's I'm 11:30 just doing drugs not realizing there is a huge amount 11:33 of who we are, our character. 11:35 Rich: you know it's interesting because of course as 11:38 you look back and see all the decisions that you make 11:42 as you stepped out on the edge, as I stepped out on the 11:45 edge, and did something a little bit different. 11:48 I would all of a sudden give myself a stamp of 11:51 of approval now to do that behavior once I did it one time. 11:54 When you learned how to lie your head off. 11:56 Rich: exactly, you actually claim you didn't never lied, 11:59 you never lied you would make those claims. 12:02 Cheri: I'm honest. 12:03 Rich: I'm an honest guy and you would be offended, of course, 12:05 if someone called you a liar naturally. 12:07 Cheri: Somebody said, how do you know they're lying because 12:09 they open their mouth. 12:10 Rich: yeah exactly! Only your lips are moving. 12:12 And even in that lifestyle, everything becomes who you 12:16 can con and who you can manipulate and who you can lie. 12:20 The truth is weird in that lifestyle, it's unnatural. 12:24 Rich: exactly so you live in this fantasy world that 12:27 everything is okay, but you have given everything a 12:29 stamp of approval as you move out farther and farther 12:32 and farther, so it's okay in your mind, 12:34 but really at one point in time you knew it wasn't okay. 12:37 Cheri: sexually! 12:38 Rich: same thing, you just do everything perverted, 12:41 everything is perverted. 12:43 Cheri: you know to me, one time in my recovery, 12:46 I came upon a statement of Ellen White's, 12:49 where she talked about cultivated sins, 12:52 natural and cultivated sins. 12:55 And I thought I can't even tell you what I learned to 13:00 be drawn to in that lifestyle, so I am glad that that 13:04 was brought out so it is not just the drugs, 13:07 it's not just that you learn to lie and steal and you 13:12 learn to tweak your character and your mind so 13:14 where you are not the same person. 13:17 Rich: exactly, even your surroundings because after 13:20 I did cocaine I got into methamphetamine and did that 13:23 for about 10 years. 13:24 Cheri: so what's the difference between Coke and Meth 13:26 for the people that don't know, even in lifestyle? 13:30 Methamphetamine to me, well once I start smoking it, 13:34 to tell you the difference. 13:35 I can't really describe a difference in my response to 13:40 it because I knew when I first tried coke that was the 13:44 answer to all my problems. 13:45 I had gotten so far in it that it no longer did what 13:51 it needed to do. 13:52 So then when I tried smoking crank that became the 13:56 answer to all my problems. 13:57 That's all I was interested in was my drug choice was 14:00 more, it didn't really matter what it was, what ever it 14:03 was to get me where I needed to be, to self medicate, 14:07 to keep me away from reality. 14:09 Cheri: what is really interesting a lot of people will 14:11 go from Coke which is socially acceptable drugs, you are 14:14 still staying involved in sometimes social situations. 14:18 Meth and crank, you are off, you are psychotic, you can 14:21 get delusional, you're paranoid. 14:23 I mean it literally takes you out even being able to 14:26 step into a social realm, you're out of that. 14:28 Rich: yeah this is what happened. 14:29 I started getting more and more removed from society. 14:33 The whole time you are saying this is okay, 14:37 because the drug... 14:39 Cheri: this is what I want. 14:40 Rich: this is what I want, this is what I need. 14:41 People ask me why don't you ever quit and 14:43 I would say why? 14:44 I couldn't see how bad I was living, so now I'm 14:47 living in downtown Sacramento in a little one-room 14:51 shack with a dirt floor with the chemicals to cook 14:54 the methamphetamine buried underneath were I slept. 14:57 I don't want anybody to get to it. 14:58 Cheri: You don't want anybody to steal it. 14:59 Not thinking what if this blows up. 15:02 Rich: anything, you know logic is thrown out the 15:05 window just so that we can get into our bodies what 15:09 ever it is we need to have in there so we can escape. 15:13 Cheri: so in that when we followed you through that where 15:17 did you guys meet Susan? 15:19 Susan: we met after we both started doing 15:21 methamphetamine. 15:22 Cheri: so in that one-room shack was your home? 15:26 Susan: no we never, I don't know what was we were 15:30 a couple but we kept separate I think it was because 15:33 he was more of a loner, but we were great friends 15:36 and great partners because all we wanted to do is 15:38 to get and use drugs that was our goal in life. 15:41 Cheri: so where did you come from, because we heard 15:43 were he came from, a normal family and all 15:46 that kind of stuff? 15:47 Susan: as normal as it can be, I look back now and I 15:49 know that my mom and dad did the very best they could. 15:52 I was sexually molested when I was younger for many 15:54 years, and at the age of 10 I start smoking and drinking 15:59 because that is what covered up that big dark hole 16:02 I had inside of me. 16:04 Cheri: that shame, you're not normal. 16:06 Susan: Right, because I knew I would never be like any 16:07 other girl I had ever come in contact with. 16:10 I was dirty, I was not worthy to be loved and so 16:13 if I could just be someone other than who I was 16:16 then I was okay. 16:18 Cheri: don't you, to me my heart breaks when you hear 16:22 somebody say I decided that at 10? 16:25 And I want to say just one thing, probably the decision 16:28 wasn't at 10, but you had probably decided that years 16:31 before, the decision to use at 10, 16:33 the decision to escape was at 10. Susan: right! 16:36 Cheri: and it works! 16:38 Susan: it did for a time, it did so by the time I was in 16:42 eighth grade, well the time I was in sixth grade I had 16:45 started smoking pot. 16:46 By the time I was in eighth grade I started using 16:48 cocaine, sophomore in high school every other weekend by 16:51 the time I was a senior I was using it every day and 16:54 then I had my first arrest. 16:56 Cheri: as a senior in high school? 16:58 Susan: yes, just got out of high school. 17:00 Cheri: for drugs... Susan: correct! 17:01 I sold an ounce of cocaine to an uncover police officer. 17:06 Cheri: so as that unfolded you went from Coke, how did 17:11 Meth come into the picture? 17:13 Susan: the same thing I tried to do geographical 17:15 because I figured if I could just get away... 17:18 Cheri: So nobody knows what a geographical is. 17:20 It's funny you said that, because I mean an addict 17:23 is like oh yeah, okay go ahead, normal people are 17:26 not going to know what that means. 17:27 Susan: if I just move to someplace where nobody knew who 17:30 I was, if they didn't know I had just gotten arrested. 17:33 The town I grew up was a very small town and my father 17:36 had worked there, the family is very well known, if I 17:39 could just get away from my surroundings and the people. 17:42 It's the people I hang out with and there is a problem. 17:45 It's the cops that busted me, had they just left me 17:47 alone, to let me do what I wanted to do then everything 17:49 would have been okay. 17:50 So I moved to Hawaii for five and one half years, and the 17:54 very first person I met was a drug dealer. 17:56 Cheri: because for a lot of druggies is we don't 18:00 see anybody but dealers or people that are like us. 18:04 You can see the craziness or the chaos in their 18:07 life or in their eyes and were drawn to each other. 18:10 Until we literally choose recovery we are 18:13 drawn to one another. 18:14 Susan: I always wondered, you know I went through 18:18 physical abuse, to smoking, crack, cocaine and I went 18:22 to get help and I said, can you help me change this person, 18:25 I don't know why he is hitting me. 18:27 He said to me you know you are an addict and you 18:29 need help, and I said what are you talking about 18:32 you know I don't need that and I finally ended up 18:34 coming back to the states because I ran out everything 18:37 in Hawaii and came back. 18:39 A family member was doing crank and that's 18:41 how I started doing that. 18:43 Cheri: so you start using Meth... 18:45 Susan: starting using Meth for about 10 years and 18:49 I am a 3 time felon, so I'm in an out of jail. 18:53 Cheri: all drug charges - yeah! 18:55 The last time I was arrested my father was the Mayor 18:59 of the city I grew up in and it was the biggest bust 19:02 in that county and there were a lot of weapons there. 19:05 I had never held a gun before, but they charged me 19:08 with that so I have a bunch of enhancements and all 19:11 different kinds of things. 19:12 Cheri: another thing, people that are in a normal 19:15 background, is that it is part of the lifestyle. 19:18 I mean you are cooking Meth, you've got people in and out, 19:20 there's guns everywhere and it doesn't even bother you. 19:23 I remember at times having somebody so paranoid that 19:26 they would take a gun and go in the backyard and 19:29 decide they are going to watch because they knew 19:31 for sure the FBI was after us. 19:32 They would stay all night long in a crouched position 19:35 with a gun and wait for anybody to show up. 19:37 I'm think of the fact that most of us don't end up 19:41 killing somebody is miraculous, but at that time I 19:44 want you to explain cooking Meth, being in that 19:48 lifestyle what is that like? 19:50 Rich: the thing is... 19:52 Susan: well for me you cannot wake up in the morning 19:56 or go to sleep at night unless you have enough to wake 20:01 up and enough to go to sleep. 20:03 You have got to make sure, I mean we stay up till 20:05 3-4 in the morning waiting for someone to call us so 20:08 we can go and make sure that we had enough drugs 20:10 so we could wake up the next morning. 20:12 That's how bad it was. 20:14 Cheri: because if you didn't have them... 20:15 Susan: we couldn't function. 20:16 Rich: you couldn't function. 20:17 I would drive around, I had a work truck, 20:20 I was still pouring concrete. 20:21 Somehow I manage to continue some form of employment 20:25 and I could remember, I had all the chemicals in the 20:28 back of the truck and I was driving around working, 20:32 and if you get caught with that kind of stuff it's a 20:36 pretty bad situation. 20:40 Cheri: just for people, we're going to get into 20:43 this little bit more, next segment, but chemically 20:46 you have gotten yourself so tweaked that you really 20:49 are not feeling normal unless you can jack 20:52 up all those chemicals. 20:53 Rich: exactly, yeah! 20:55 Cheri: so you're making sure you had enough get up in the morning 20:58 Susan: had enough to get up in the morning. 21:00 Cheri: What is the longest that you ever stayed awake? 21:03 Susan: probably 2 weeks straight. 21:08 Cheri: frying literally stuffing yourself full of whatever drug 21:13 is in front of you. Susan and Rich: Right! 21:14 Susan: whatever drug because then you would cook it and 21:17 it probably really wasn't crank but you went ahead 21:19 and did it anyway, thinking it was. 21:21 Cheri: so you know, and to me, again, I don't think anyone, 21:27 unless you are there, understands the craziness that 21:30 a week of being awake, what two weeks of being 21:34 awake looks like, what your teeth look like, what your 21:38 skin looks like, what your brain looks like, how it 21:41 processes information, although things were so crazy. 21:45 Man, I'm thinking all this craziness, I'm serious, 21:49 my body hurts for you guys right now. 21:52 And so your living environment you guys meet 21:56 and decide to date. 21:57 Rich: if you call it dating, yeah one common goal 22:01 getting to use drugs, it didn't matter if we had to 22:03 drive from Sacramento to San Jose in the middle 22:06 of the night to get drugs or whatever 22:08 it took that was the goal. 22:10 Susan: and you asked a question from Rich earlier 22:13 you know what else goes along with the lifestyle. 22:16 That probably was the hardest, I did everything I had 22:20 to do in order to use drugs, no matter what it was. 22:23 Whether it was stealing, I put my parents 22:27 through a lot of stealing... 22:28 Cheri: taking everything they own. 22:29 Susan: everything... Cheri: pawned it! 22:30 Whatever I had to do with the opposite sex, hang out with 22:37 whoever I needed to hang out with. 22:39 Dressed a specific way to try to attract 22:41 just immoral things. 22:44 Cheri: that is a part of the lifestyle, and a very 22:48 natural part of the lifestyle, in fact if you were not 22:51 doing that you would actually stand out because it's 22:55 like what do you mean. 22:56 Of course you're going to play some one, of course 22:58 you're going to sexually get tweaked and the anger and the 23:03 rage is amazing to me in that lifestyle, 23:06 did you ever feel that? 23:08 Susan: no I don't think I was a real angry drug user. 23:13 Rich: no we did not have nice things to say about 23:18 people that is for sure. 23:20 Susan: but we hung around people who were really angry. 23:23 oh yeah... 23:25 Cheri: because they would put holes in walls. 23:26 Susan: oh yeah! 23:27 Cheri: and totally flipped out, I just remember the 23:30 rage and then again I don't think I was into that 23:33 too much but I can remember with Meth addicts the rage 23:35 was unbelievable, the anger that would all of a sudden 23:38 come up in the next statement would be and so what 23:41 are we going to do? 23:42 And I'm like, do realize you just killed that person, 23:45 I mean it's like it didn't matter, what are we going to do 23:48 later on tonight? 23:49 Rich: and the filth, the filth I would sleep for days 23:53 when I didn't have the drugs, with my shoes on. 23:56 I wouldn't shower for days and even if I was on the 24:00 drugs, I would go in the same clothes for days. 24:04 I don't how people put up with me... 24:06 Susan: and the diet, the non-diet, we didn't eat, 24:11 we didn't drink water, we were just a mess. 24:14 Cheri: if I were starving I would get Hostess 24:17 Twinkies and butter, and put butter on the Hostess 24:20 Twinkies and put them in the oven and that was like 24:22 a good meal to me. 24:23 Rich: yeah you know it reminds me of a story. 24:27 One time I was starving and I had just come down 24:31 off of crank. 24:32 I had gotten up in the morning and I was so hungry, I 24:37 hadn't eaten in probably a week and a half. 24:39 There was a lucky store right across the street... 24:42 Cheri: how about drinking fluids? 24:44 Rich: no you don't drink, you're so dry. 24:47 Cheri: I just want to get a picture for people 24:49 because you don't drink, you don't eat, your body 24:51 just, I can't even believe we survive it. 24:53 Rich: so I'm starving, I go down to my truck, it's an 24:59 old beat-up truck and it's got this change, you know you have 25:02 stashes where you have a little bit of change here and there. 25:05 I'm almost tearing the seat out of this truck to get 25:08 enough change to go over there so I can buy one of 25:13 them Stouffer's four cheese lasagna, and I eat one of 25:17 those about every 2 weeks. 25:19 So I get enough change to go down there and I walk 25:22 across the street and I go in and I walked past the 25:25 cigarettes and I start looking at the cigarettes. 25:28 I don't have any cigarettes either, and I look over 25:31 at the food and I buy the cigarettes. 25:34 Cheri: We are going to go ahead and take a break, 25:38 but sometimes when we meet people, and some of you 25:41 are in this place, were you think that 25:44 God even can't get here. 25:46 God can't even get through this, and I just want 25:49 to say not true. 25:51 And that is the most amazing thing, we can take 25:54 ourselves to such destructive places, and if you are 25:57 sitting out there smiling and you haven't gone through 26:00 Meth, sometimes destructive places for us that are 26:03 more normal, they just don't look as bad. 26:05 But they are as bad, they are infested with junk, somebody 26:09 that is a perfectionist, or a religious addiction 26:12 or something that is a spend-a-holic, 26:14 I'm telling you it's the same and God knows where 26:17 you're at and can bring you out. 26:18 So we are going to come back and find out what did God 26:20 do with these guys, oh man! 26:22 Stay with us will be right back! |
Revised 2014-12-17